Bad UI

[anko]

Actually, the hack is quite simple: replace the fuel pump fuse by a bit of wiring and a switch and ignore the warning messages.

And another meaningless response.

 

[wws]

But back to the OPs problem. Does Mitsu have a menu to select what temp threshold to run the ICE in the cold? If not, is it easy to get to the appropriate outside air temp sensor and change its range (e.g., via carefully chosen resistors) to something more palatable? As I mentioned a few posts ago, some Volt owners have been doing this for years.

Ok did the Volt have preheat or pre-defrost or pre-cooling while plugged in or stopped? That to me is very good feature of the Outlander phev.

Yes, all Volts have the feature. It is activated either by a button press on the key fob, or remotely via the Onstar phone app.

 

[STS134]

Does this work for early model European cars? This topic has been done to death here in the past and I don't recall the option of booting the car without starting it followed by turning off climate control ever being mentioned. It's not something that has ever concerned me very much, but I was under the impression that the climate control functions only worked once the car had been fully booted up.

Really? I thought all of them worked like this (mine certainly does):

A. Press brake pedal AND POWER button -> Vehicle ON (READY shows in instrument cluster)

B1. Press POWER button only from Vehicle OFF state -> Entertainment System On
B2. Press POWER button only from Entertainment On State -> Ignition On (Instrument cluster lights up, climate controls turn on, etc, but READY does NOT show in instrument cluster). In this state, you can SET the climate controls, but the climate controls won't actually operate, except for the fan (i.e. if you have heat or AC set, the heat or AC will not actually function).
B3. Press POWER button only from Ignition On state -> Vehicle OFF

You have to get it to the Ignition On state, at which point, you can shut down the climate controls. Then you can switch the vehicle ON by doing action (A).

 

[maby]

...

You have to get it to the Ignition On state, at which point, you can shut down the climate controls. Then you can switch the vehicle ON by doing action (A).

Hmmm, ok - I will try it out of curiosity the next time I use the car...

 

[Trex]

Sorry mort been too busy at work managing my own engineering business to reply to you. Will do so now during "smoko" or morning tea time while my fellow workers do not need me. Yes I mainly work on the factory floor where ever I am needed at the time including welding, fitting and turning helping fit PLCs, electric motors, hydralic pumps and cylinders and running the electric wiring and hydraulic pipes and compressed air lines and compressed air cylinders for the different machines we build or even driving the crane and forklifts and trucks or even piloting a plane to install or service those machines in far away places over here when I am not in front of a computer screen doing the 3D design work and motion control programming and ordering parts and writing out owner's and service manuals for those specialised machine I design, some of which I have gone to the trouble of Patenting or are Pat pending. Only have to work a minimum of 50 hrs a week to do those jobs.

Trex, Thanks for your beautiful dissertation on who I am! nicely done.

That would be my pleasure mort. But please stop. You are embarrassing me with your accolades to me. :lol:

You are a man of many words however mostly B.S.

Ooh, did I strike a nerve mort. Pretty sure you can buy an ointment for that. :lol:

Actually I am not trolling at all. I have identified an issue with a vehicle that I mostly otherwise love to drive and remain proud of.

:lol: :lol:

Well done. That statement really did crack me up.

So you have previously stated you are not bashing and have now stated you were not trolling.

Lets bring in that first post again:

I am sure there is a related thread however I cant find it in the search engine.
The UI in the PHEV is terrible compared to my 13 Volt.
It drives me crazy that if I want to utilize the defroster on my 14 mile round trip commute the engine starts!
This is completely unnecessary.
Currently to prevent it I have to select EV, ECO, Auto on climate, Mode button three times to get to defrost/foot well.
Then if I forget to turn off climate when I leave the car the next start cycle the vehicle immediately starts the dam engine.
God I wish Tesla would start production of the "Y"
Is there a fix for this?
:evil:

That love and being proud is just oozing out of your post there. I just don't know how I missed it. I really must apologise for seeing bashing and trolling "stuff" which is not really there. :roll: :lol: That bit about Tesla model Y you were just joking about. :lol:

But that love and being proud might be showing in your second post in this topic. Lets bring that in:

I am not attempting to "Bash" hopefully someone at Mitsubishi picks this up as feedback. The most valuable improvements to a manufacturers vehicles come from owners.

It is totally useless for you to tell someone to just sell it and move on. Plus there is no model Y yet.

Also it should be noted that people who are active on the forum might believe that issues on the forum, even regularly discussed ones are common knowledge. As I noted in the OP, I could not find info on this problem using the search engine. I waited for this vehicle for 5 years, studying every thing I could about it on this forum on European forums, on the Mitsubishi website and I read every review I could find. No where was this mentioned.
With the volt, users have been accustomed to using all available battery power before the engine turns on, that is the very beauty of a PHEV, only use gas when it is absolutely necessary. It is never necessary on a 15 mile commute, Period.
Stop making excuses for poor design. Our Volt has 80000 miles with no battery degradation and is driven like this every day. Believe me if Chevrolet can get it right than Mitsubishi has no excuse.

mort I can definitely feel the love and being proud in that post for Outlander PHEV. :roll: The Tesla model Y is still getting a mention.

:lol: :lol:

Sorry just had a laughing attack and my side is hurting.

This is actually an issue for me.
I do not live in a extreme climate. our average daily winter temperatures are in the 40's (F.)
We might experience 5 mornings a year in the 20F degree range. This is a very temperate climate.
It is warm enough that I do not regularly use heat other than my seat heat, or the occasional offending defrost.
My typical defrost session is completed before the air vents even begin to produce any warmth yet the engine is still running.
I don't even utilize level 2 charging at home, that is for my wife's car, strait 12 amp 120v level 1 is good for my needs, as a result you're right I never pre-heat.
Pre heating is not necessary we don't get frost. Defrost is only needed due to our high humidity, occupants drinking steamy beverages or at times wet clothes.

Ok. You have finally IMHO giving some of information we need to be help you. If you had started with this in your first post it all might have gone so differently.

Got to go back to work.

To be continued.

 

[mort]

Wow, I thought I was a fan boy!

 

[jaapv]

Actually, the hack is quite simple: replace the fuel pump fuse by a bit of wiring and a switch and ignore the warning messages.

And another meaningless response.

Your irony detector switch should be a sticky...

 

[elm70]

Well, I don't think you can take the contents of this forum as evidence for how "most" or even "many" users feel about the design of the car - we have a few dozen members here, many of whom rarely contribute and have made no comment about the relative pattern of petrol and battery powered activity in the PHEV. I have not looked at the recent sales figures, but your post seems to indicate that there are at least 100,000 examples sold - we here are certainly not a scientifically chosen sample of the total ownership.

There was an article published by the BBC recently which described research indicating that a high proportion of the PHEVs sold in Britain, at least, had never been plugged in. That is thousands of owners who treat it as a petrol vehicle. I'm certainly in that category and do everything I can to minimise the usage of the battery - the short EV range makes it irrelevant to me and all I want is to maximise its lifetime.

Interesting point maby

I believe the success of PHEV in some markets (like UK), is purely due to tax incentive

Take away the tax incentive, and people would not buy a PHEV and use it as an Hybrid car. (an Hybrid car having a smaller battery is cheaper and more efficient then a PHEV, when used without "plug in")

For an Hybrid car user, it is irrelevant when the ICE will fire up.

Take away the funny money from tax benefit, and people that need only an Hybrid, will not pay a premium for get a PHEV instead.

So .. personally I believe that Mitsubishi should listen to people that use the PHEV in a PHEV way and not in Hybrid way .. since the tax advantage on PHEV is possible history in most of the markets.

 

[elm70]

How many is many? Certainly you accept that it is less than 50,000 but I don't see that even half the posters in this forum have complained. I agree that it seems to be a pain for some and probably anko is right that it should be easy to fix but are there enough "unhappy" drivers for Mitsu to consider it a priority and would it make any real difference to sales if it was changed? That is the real world question.

My view

In this context ... Mitsubishi want to sell PHEV and not Hybrid car

If people, like me, or Anko, or mort will not be happy how they design some "typical" PHEV features, which cause unwanted ICE start up ... possibly they will think twice before buying in the future another Mitsubishi.

I know many people that use their experience on a brand and the experience of their friends as important criteria when is time to buy a car.
So, yes ... make as many customers happy is a key for have success ... but "polishing" the brand experience is something that need years before cash the benefit of it.

PS: Having something so little and trivial to fix for improve the PHEV experience, and have it still "broken" after 5 years ... for me ... is a learning experience that tell me to be mega careful before buying again a Mitsubishi

 

[elm70]

Wow, I thought I was a fan boy!

I'm surprise that some forum members are allowed to insult other members

In my book, call somebody a troll is the worst possible insult that can be used online.

PS: To be clear ... I'm just quoting your message, since you, like me ...we have been both insulted by the same person.
I guess, this is the "cost" to be paid for criticize the design of the Outlander PHEV
BTW: There is more to learn from a negative feedback then not from a positive feedback, so ... it does not help Mitsubishi on making better cars getting only domesticated positive feedback.

 

[Dimanych]

Just wondering is it only US/Canada models allow you to force-start car in EV mode? Brake pedal + EV button + Start button? To be honest I did not know about 10 seconds delay.

I was reading through 9 pages :| A long time BEV user I learn how to cycle heat on and off to save battery juice. Even driving PHEV now I switch off heat couple kilometers before destination.
Personally I think that for average driver it works perfect. For planned trip car is preheated and even with heat on ICE not engaged in EV mode. In cold days with cold cells I want engine on. At work we have 4 hour policy on charger. At 12.40 car is programmed to heat up for 20 minutes, so I can move my car from charger without dressing up. ICE never kicks in even if it is -20C outside. My 2 cents.

 

[maby]

Well, I don't think you can take the contents of this forum as evidence for how "most" or even "many" users feel about the design of the car - we have a few dozen members here, many of whom rarely contribute and have made no comment about the relative pattern of petrol and battery powered activity in the PHEV. I have not looked at the recent sales figures, but your post seems to indicate that there are at least 100,000 examples sold - we here are certainly not a scientifically chosen sample of the total ownership.

There was an article published by the BBC recently which described research indicating that a high proportion of the PHEVs sold in Britain, at least, had never been plugged in. That is thousands of owners who treat it as a petrol vehicle. I'm certainly in that category and do everything I can to minimise the usage of the battery - the short EV range makes it irrelevant to me and all I want is to maximise its lifetime.

Interesting point maby

I believe the success of PHEV in some markets (like UK), is purely due to tax incentive

Take away the tax incentive, and people would not buy a PHEV and use it as an Hybrid car. (an Hybrid car having a smaller battery is cheaper and more efficient then a PHEV, when used without "plug in")

For an Hybrid car user, it is irrelevant when the ICE will fire up.

Take away the funny money from tax benefit, and people that need only an Hybrid, will not pay a premium for get a PHEV instead.

So .. personally I believe that Mitsubishi should listen to people that use the PHEV in a PHEV way and not in Hybrid way .. since the tax advantage on PHEV is possible history in most of the markets.

The danger with that approach is, of course, that without the tax dodgers the market place would not be great enough to keep the production line running for the (PH)EV purists. The PHEV is one of the best selling hybrids, but the numbers are still very small compared with any successful conventional car. You eco-nuts need us tax dodgers to keep the vehicle on sale and under development.

 

[Trex]

Ok mort just have a minute here at work, can you tell me if you are just having problems with your front windscreen fogging up from excessive moisture?

Can you also tell me if the North American model of the PHEV has the built in electric front windscreen heater ie My newer PHEV has a built in resistive heater embedded into the front windscreen made up of tiny wires that you can run a current through them and has a separate button to turn it on at the climate control panel compared with my older PHEV that does not have that feature.

Now I do not get to drive my PHEVs that often (wife and eldest son are the regular drivers) but from memory you have approx 10 sec to hit the EV priority button, and I would not worry about hitting the ECO button myself, then if it just fogging up of the front windscreen causing you problems I would just be turning on the embedded resistive heater which is just 1 button press. But the NA model may not have that resistive electric front windscreen heater.

Also from memory there are 2 resistive heaters on my newest Outlander PHEV one for the front windscreen and one for the back window with separate buttons. Just do not ask me now which is which as I could not tell you without looking at my newest PHEV which is not here at the moment as my wife is currently away with it.

Now it has been approx 6 months (1st day of autumn here) since I have had to consider this stuff ie starting of ICE in colder weather but I do not think pressing the front windscreen resistive heater starts the ICE once you are in EV priority mode but I could be wrong.

Edit If the above does not work just running the heater with the AC turned on will pull moisture from the car from memory. This could be also be done with pre-heating using the app I think ie pulling moisture out of a damp interior.

 

[greendwarf]

How many is many? Certainly you accept that it is less than 50,000 but I don't see that even half the posters in this forum have complained. I agree that it seems to be a pain for some and probably anko is right that it should be easy to fix but are there enough "unhappy" drivers for Mitsu to consider it a priority and would it make any real difference to sales if it was changed? That is the real world question.

My view

In this context ... Mitsubishi want to sell PHEV and not Hybrid car

If people, like me, or Anko, or mort will not be happy how they design some "typical" PHEV features, which cause unwanted ICE start up ... possibly they will think twice before buying in the future another Mitsubishi.

I know many people that use their experience on a brand and the experience of their friends as important criteria when is time to buy a car.
So, yes ... make as many customers happy is a key for have success ... but "polishing" the brand experience is something that need years before cash the benefit of it.

PS: Having something so little and trivial to fix for improve the PHEV experience, and have it still "broken" after 5 years ... for me ... is a learning experience that tell me to be mega careful before buying again a Mitsubishi

Of course, you are right that brand loyalty & personal recommendation are significant sales factors, especially for "big ticket" items like cars that people can't afford to get wrong. The question is how many "ankos" & "elm70s" are there against those like myself (and Trex?) who are regular public brand ambassadors? - I have people stop me in the street to ask about the PHEV :roll:

Neither you nor I know the answer but it was you that suggested that there are "many" unhappy users. Is that just your opinion or is it based on actual complaints you have seen or heard? I only ask because Mitsu might be interested to know the answer.

 

[Klausm]

PS: I suggest to make the keyfob hack ... for activate the defrost from a double click on keyfob ... this hack is the best feature in my PHEV ... it is more convenient to have the car defrosted before starting the trip, than do it "later"

How does that work? What do you have to do to do that?