Return to EV mode after gas engine starts

[BruceHF]

I dont bother with EV mode ever. IK live in Canada and in the winter months it wont even go into EV mode until the engine has warmed up enough.
So why dont I bother? Because my 2020 model has what is know as 'Series' mode which by the ay is automatic. ( I am no technie but I experience it daily.)
What that means that even when the battery is exhausted and the engine runs the engine under normal conditions charges the battery (without being 'switched to 'charge') and the battery drives the wheels. However if you need to put yur foot down the engine will immediately star to drive the wheels not via the battery.
The long and short of this is that I just drive and my fuel economy never exceeds 9.oL/100 km. and that is doing 115/120 kmp/h on the highway. I have over 65,000 km over 3 years. I do use cruise control to try and keep under 120. Yes I drive on the highway most of the way. If I know I am going into Toronto ( heavy stop/start driving I either 'save' half may battery ( +- 15 km) or if empty i just bear with eth stop/start scenario. Hope this helops

 

[BobK]

This does not work on my US 2020.

I find on my 2023, once the gas engine turns on it will run for 5 min or so no matter what you do. I think this is to prevent condensation forming before the engine is fully heated. Some members on the forum doubt 5 minutes is long enough to fully heat the engine.

 

[PHEV07]

I find on my 2023, once the gas engine turns on it will run for 5 min or so no matter what you do. I think this is to prevent condensation forming before the engine is fully heated. Some members on the forum doubt 5 minutes is long enough to fully heat the engine.

On my 2024 I have found that while driving in the city in EV, ECO, B-0, and full battery with HVAC off, the ICE does sometimes kick on for no reason at all. When this happens, I just pull over when safe to do so and turn off the car and restart the car. The ICE then stays off

Sometimes when I start the car, the ICE turns on, i let it run 1 minutee. Turn it off and restart it and the ICE stays off.

I have read the Manual, read many posts on this forum and none of this info seem to explain the reason for some of these issues. I am beginning to believe that these issues are merely due to glitches in the software for the 2023, 2024 and probably the latest 2025.

All we can do is try to find some work around ideas to try to Maximize our EV Range.

Those that are happy to drive the Outlander PHEV just as a Hybrid mode, need not worry about any of this info.

 

[Woon Chung]

On my 2024 I have found that while driving in the city in EV, ECO, B-0, and full battery with HVAC off, the ICE does sometimes kick on for no reason at all. When this happens, I just pull over when safe to do so and turn off the car and restart the car. The ICE then stays off

Sometimes when I start the car, the ICE turns on, i let it run 1 minutee. Turn it off and restart it and the ICE stays off.

I have read the Manual, read many posts on this forum and none of this info seem to explain the reason for some of these issues. I am beginning to believe that these issues are merely due to glitches in the software for the 2023, 2024 and probably the latest 2025.

All we can do is try to find some work around ideas to try to Maximize our EV Range.

Those that are happy to drive the Outlander PHEV just as a Hybrid mode, need not worry about any of this info.

Did you drive in normal mode, instead of ECo mode? If it happens in Eco mode only, it will be related with Eco character. Eco limits acceleration in general. That means when the car needs any kind of extra power instantly to drive according to the road envirnment, Eco mode is blocking the instant high power. As a result, main computer trys to generate power from ICE, not for charging. We call it Series mode. This is just a guess.

Somehow it sound meaningless, but we cannot extend EV range except slow start and maintain steady speed. Every mechanical and electrical system is sometimes as stupid as not allowing any exceptions. Eco is not special method, but limit sudden increase of using electricity, by the motor and by the 12V system. Engineers also know this Law of Physics, which was announced 350 years ago by Newton. Battery max capacity cannot be created by the user, but it already has been fixed by the manufacturer tech level. Except this limits, we can think about seriously how the regen works for charging. I don't know yet.

Motor charging and generator charging is different. Generator charging is using the ICE and it makes worse in gas mileage when we use. Gas used for charging can drive more distance than charged energy can provide EV distance. Motor charging is using inercia which is based on the Newton's Law. It is free. but I don't know the mechamism yet. So I do not know the difference between B1 to B5. B5 makes more electro magnetic resistance in wires around the motor to create more electricity, but it shortened the distance of moving. As a result, we have to recover the lost distance by using more energy. What could be the plus between charge and consume for same distance driving. To me, it returns to slow start and steady speed theory. By the way, if increasing electro-magnetic force to get more resistance, it also consumes more electricity for this purpose. That sounds to me that more regen charge, it use more electricity to generate more strong electro-magnetic field. My knowledge is limited at this much. No further undstanding of B function yet.

Maybe all others are happy with PHEV since they already know all about the mechanism of PHEV's real scientific backgrund?

 

[PHEV07]

Did you drive in normal mode, instead of ECo mode? If it happens in Eco mode only, it will be related with Eco character. Eco limits acceleration in general. That means when the car needs any kind of extra power instantly to drive according to the road envirnment, Eco mode is blocking the instant high power. As a result, main computer trys to generate power from ICE, not for charging. We call it Series mode. This is just a guess.

Somehow it sound meaningless, but we cannot extend EV range except slow start and maintain steady speed. Every mechanical and electrical system is sometimes as stupid as not allowing any exceptions. Eco is not special method, but limit sudden increase of using electricity, by the motor and by the 12V system. Engineers also know this Law of Physics, which was announced 350 years ago by Newton. Battery max capacity cannot be created by the user, but it already has been fixed by the manufacturer tech level. Except this limits, we can think about seriously how the regen works for charging. I don't know yet.

Motor charging and generator charging is different. Generator charging is using the ICE and it makes worse in gas mileage when we use. Gas used for charging can drive more distance than charged energy can provide EV distance. Motor charging is using inercia which is based on the Newton's Law. It is free. but I don't know the mechamism yet. So I do not know the difference between B1 to B5. B5 makes more electro magnetic resistance in wires around the motor to create more electricity, but it shortened the distance of moving. As a result, we have to recover the lost distance by using more energy. What could be the plus between charge and consume for same distance driving. To me, it returns to slow start and steady speed theory. By the way, if increasing electro-magnetic force to get more resistance, it also consumes more electricity for this purpose. That sounds to me that more regen charge, it use more electricity to generate more strong electro-magnetic field. My knowledge is limited at this much. No further undstanding of B function yet.

Maybe all others are happy with PHEV since they already know all about the mechanism of PHEV's real scientific backgrund?

Thanks for the explanation but unfortunately this issue appears to be related to the 2024 Models.

I never had the issue of the ICE kicking in out of the blue when I had sufficient Main Battey Power, did not accelerate speed, had the HVAC off, temperature between 10' to 25'C.

I did try driving in regular mode ( not ECO Mode) and the ICE kicked in again.

The easy fix thst I found was to just pull over and restart the car.

I also tried a different starting sequence, namely

1) Start car with no Brake pedal pressed
2) Press EV Button
3) Press Brake Pedal and Restart

Same thing happens if I press the EV Button 1st then Brake Pedal and Start.

The 2022 I had also had a few minor quirks but not as bad as the 2024.

I do still believe that it may be due to a few software glitches with the 2024.

 

[PHEV07]

I've had some of these experiences and not others. 2023 Nov PHEV. We live at the bottom of a steep hill that extends about 200m directly in front of our garage... so pretty much the first thing that happens to the car is a steep climb.

If I'm very careful on the accelerator, the car will do the climb without starting the ICE. If the ICE does start, then it runs for some amount of time that the car understands but I do not.

However anecdotally it seems that if I stop the car for a while (that might be 15 seconds or so?) the ICE will shut down and then I can move off without the ICE starting. If I don't stop, then the ICE continues to idle/pickup to support the motors, even if I'm only gently feathering the accelerator. Eventually (if I'm not heavy on the pedal, or the car isn't constantly going up steep hills) the ICE shuts down and I'm back on battery-only.

All that without changing the battery setting from default.

Definitely the ICE will start and run if I floor the pedal. That's as expected.

Many of us are having similar issues. As you mention, the only way I have been Ble to have the ziCE shut of is by restarting the car.

I believe that there is a software glitches that is causing this because my previous 2018 and 2022 Models never did this.

 

[PHEV07]

Once the engine starts it is better to run until it reaches optimal operating temperature. That's why it keeps running.

This was happing to me as well this summer, on my 2024 when outside temp was from 20 to 25'C

 

[Woon Chung]

Thanks for the explanation but unfortunately this issue appears to be related to the 2024 Models.

I never had the issue of the ICE kicking in out of the blue when I had sufficient Main Battey Power, did not accelerate speed, had the HVAC off, temperature between 10' to 25'C.

I did try driving in regular mode ( not ECO Mode) and the ICE kicked in again.

The easy fix thst I found was to just pull over and restart the car.

I also tried a different starting sequence, namely

1) Start car with no Brake pedal pressed
2) Press EV Button
3) Press Brake Pedal and Restart

Same thing happens if I press the EV Button 1st then Brake Pedal and Start.

The 2022 I had also had a few minor quirks but not as bad as the 2024.

I do still believe that it may be due to a few software glitches with the 2024.

Thanks for kind reply. You maybe right since you are in position to compare different model directly.

 

[themaiz]

After driving my car for most of a year (since this time last year), the only correlation I can see with ICE runtime is that it starts when there is high demand or no battery capacity, and it stops when it feels like it. Generally that is some time after demand is removed. Today that was when I switched from SAVE mode back to normal. At that point the battery had 43km reserve and the car then climbed a very steep hill for several kilometres without starting the ICE. But unless I am very careful, the ICE will always start when I drive out of my garage up the 200m of hill that extends from my garage to the next intersection.

 

[PHEV07]

After driving my car for most of a year (since this time last year), the only correlation I can see with ICE runtime is that it starts when there is high demand or no battery capacity, and it stops when it feels like it. Generally that is some time after demand is removed. Today that was when I switched from SAVE mode back to normal. At that point the battery had 43km reserve and the car then climbed a very steep hill for several kilometres without starting the ICE. But unless I am very careful, the ICE will always start when I drive out of my garage up the 200m of hill that extends from my garage to the next intersection.

What year model do you have?

What is your starting sequence?

 

[kernelpanic]

On my 2019 model, I do get the ICE kicking in if My right foot is too heavy.
The algorithm is certainly seeing a request for more power and starts the ICE so that the generator can give extra current to the motors.


Remembering that the engine is cold when this happens, I think the software is letting the engine come up to it's normal operating temperature before it shuts it down.
Personally I prefer not to second guess the Engine Management System, pulling over to shut down the car may result in cold starting the ICE more often, which would reduce engine life in the long term.

Enjoy your Outlanders !

 

[themaiz]

What year model do you have?

As per the signature, Nov 2023 Exceed Tourer

What is your starting sequence?

Nothing special ever. Foot on brake, press button, wait for seat move [and squash me flat if Mrs TheMaiz was the last person to drive], then put foot on accelerator and drive up the hill.

The car would normally be reversed into the garage, and we're at the end of a court, so it literally is drive straight up six metres of rising driveway, followed by a pause to shut the door, then 120m of steep upward street to the next corner where I'm at the top of a hill in all three directions. That's significant. If I'm careful the ICE doesn't start. If I'm not, it starts and then does not shut down unless

• I stop and wait for it to shut down, or
• I drive with exceptionally light pressure.

Even then the ICE will only shut down after a couple of hundred metres EVEN THOUGH all the driving is down hill and the ICE isn't needed at all to propel the car.

But if I stop and wait for it to shut down it stays stopped when I drive off, so it doesn't feel like it's saying "OK, running, so I'd better warm up/burn off". It just feels like it doesn't like shutting down too soon after starting. But that's also variable. Some times it shuts down quickly. I've almost given up looking for a pattern - my technique is to not accelerate wildly from standing, and don't let it start.

 

[Woon Chung]

On my 2019 model, I do get the ICE kicking in if My right foot is too heavy.
The algorithm is certainly seeing a request for more power and starts the ICE so that the generator can give extra current to the motors.

I think you are good at understanding of PHEV, but there is slightly different idea about more power from Electric Motor. I agree with you that depressing hard on speed pedal will kick ICE, but it works in 2 different ways.

First case - Against high power request from driver, the computer checks fuel and battery level. If battery level is not good for high power requirement, ICE runs generator to charge the battery. But it never increases motor torque directly. Motor torque is fixed all the time in wide range of RPM. Nothing can maneuver the output Torque once it is made by manufacturer. Such as, more electricity from battery cannot change the motor torque. It only extends motor running time. Motor rpm is decided by the control of DC voltage by the computer, not by the battery level. So, it engage Series mode for high power if the fuel level satisfied.

Second case - If the level of battery is good for high power requirements, the computer engage Parallel mode to increase the power. It means that the computer kicks ICE for front wheel power and also runs the generator to charge the battery. In addition to that, Electric Motor also adds power to the wheels. As a result, it uses both ICE and electric motor for power source. But this Parallel mode is precisely controlled by the computer, and on and off by itself as the result of calculation considering all related data to maximize the power efficiency.

In any condition, generator is not involved in motor power directly. It only changes battery. If I'm wrong, please teach me.

Good luck to you