Cold Weather Performance - North American 2023

[Lon12]

Was the car outside before the test drive or it was taken out from a garage with a higher temperature?

Cause if it was like sleeping outside for days in the cold, it makes sense. The heater would need the engine and at least a couple of minutes to give some heat to the battery, so during that time, the power is restricted as a safety measure for the battery itself.

Now, if the car was in a garage before that, the case you described is concerning. But there are a couple of freezing temperature tests of the new Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV on Youtube, and all of them were able to get at least 50 KMs.

Car had been outside not charging. Temperature was -10ºC over night. Had sat outside for two days.
I've driven our 2018 GT through four cold winters and it never restricted EV power output. This is a new feature for the 2023 model.
I'm not talking about range. Talking about power output kW (hp) not kWh (capacity).

 

[littlescrote]

There seem to a lot of people around who figure that PHEV means you get a BEV with a backup ICE engine. It's just not that way ... it is a hybrid and the control of which power is used when is controlled by the car's software. I think the someone (dealer or Mitsu) should tell folks that the various drive modes are things you can suggest to the car but the ultimate decision is made by the car's computer after analysing the current battery level, fuel level, ambient temperature and who knows what else.

I'm glad I'm not the only one that understands how the world works and you don't get to have everything that you want.

We drove the 2018 GT for four years in up to -30C weather and it never restricted electric power output to the motors. Always had sufficient EV power to do our commute without burning fuel just to add power. So no, it is not to be expected for a PHEV. Guess I should just stick with the older model. None of the EVs I've owned have restricted their power output that much when cold soaked.

I would like to know the actual battery temperature thresholds that Mitsubishi has implemented. If the battery heater is active and warms it up enough during charging then one might be able to coast through the day outside at work and still stay above the lower limit.

You can find out all the data you like, and wish for what you like, but it won't change anything. If the product is not for you, go elsewhere I'm afraid. By all means, feedback your disappointment to Mitsubishi's product planning department, and the sharing of the limitations on here is appreciated as it may mean someone else avoids the same disappointment.

 

[Lon12]

There seem to a lot of people around who figure that PHEV means you get a BEV with a backup ICE engine. It's just not that way ... it is a hybrid and the control of which power is used when is controlled by the car's software. I think the someone (dealer or Mitsu) should tell folks that the various drive modes are things you can suggest to the car but the ultimate decision is made by the car's computer after analysing the current battery level, fuel level, ambient temperature and who knows what else.

I'm glad I'm not the only one that understands how the world works and you don't get to have everything that you want.

We drove the 2018 GT for four years in up to -30C weather and it never restricted electric power output to the motors. Always had sufficient EV power to do our commute without burning fuel just to add power. So no, it is not to be expected for a PHEV. Guess I should just stick with the older model. None of the EVs I've owned have restricted their power output that much when cold soaked.

I would like to know the actual battery temperature thresholds that Mitsubishi has implemented. If the battery heater is active and warms it up enough during charging then one might be able to coast through the day outside at work and still stay above the lower limit.

You can find out all the data you like, and wish for what you like, but it won't change anything. If the product is not for you, go elsewhere I'm afraid. By all means, feedback your disappointment to Mitsubishi's product planning department, and the sharing of the limitations on here is appreciated as it may mean someone else avoids the same disappointment.

Thanks, but I came here to try and get technical information. Not advise on expectations.

 

[drew123]

Did cabin heat work in EV mode? Some people claim that the heat pump only works down to 0 C but I haven't been able to find any actual evidence

 

[Lon12]

Yes. Cabin heat worked well. You could definitely hear the heat pump running.

 

[roussir]

I can confirm cabin heating (must be a heat pump, per manual) working in EV only at -4C to -2C today (freezing rain in Seattle area). Barely raising up the cabin temperature, but once it reaches the target, maintains it without a problem. No distinguishable noise, but I am still learning the car's sounds.

 

[Lon12]

I had a chance to test drive again today. Car had been sitting outside for two days at around freezing temperatures and not charging.
Also got to read the section about the temperature gauge in the owners manual. Basically if you are above the small white line before the blue area then the car should operate normally. If it is in the blue area you might get "Battery Too Cold" warning displayed and system may not start. At or below the small white line you might get power reduced warning.

 

[Hasenphever]

I had a chance to test drive again today. Car had been sitting outside for two days at around freezing temperatures and not charging.
Also got to read the section about the temperature gauge in the owners manual. Basically if you are above the small white line before the blue area then the car should operate normally. If it is in the blue area you might get "Battery Too Cold" warning displayed and system may not start. At or below the small white line you might get power reduced warning.
PHEV battery Temp.jpg

What does the 2018 PHEV manual say about this? To your point it would be interesting to know why this was introduced for the 2023 gen and not the previous, assuming that is the case. Maybe this is a safety feature or a design to increase battery life duration (biased wishful thinking here)?

Another thing you may wish to think about is how comparable your experiences with the 2018 PHEV was to the conditions for the 2023 PHEV. Did you ever leave your 2018 "cold soaked" and unplugged for that temperature as long as the 2023 PHEV was? It may be simply that your 2018 PHEV did not experience the same duration of being exposed to those temperature unplugged as the 2023 PHEV?

From my limited experience of the 2023 PHEV, I have not encountered this limitation yet, there may have been one stretch where the PHEV was close to sitting for 2 days unplugged in sub zero temps, but I don't recall the exact duration of the sit or temperature over that period specifically.

 

[Lon12]

It is possible that in the four years we owned the 2018 model the battery temperature never dropped below -10ºC but I doubt it. We always seem to have a week or two that our temperatures are well below -20ºC.
One of the new owners drove their 2023 model home after purchasing it and parked it outside when we had a few days of -30ºC. They did not plug it in and the car would not start. They had to have it taken to the dealership. There were no error codes after the car warmed up. So what the manual says about the car not starting and having to wait for warmer temperatures seems to be correct.
I forgot to mention that the car operated normally when I test drove it at freezing temperatures last time.

 

[Hasenphever]

Does anyone know if battery preconditioning/warming occurs when charging via a level 1 evse on a 2023+ generation? I've heard not to plug it in when the battery is full to extend the life of the battery, but would like to know if plugging in with a level 1 evse keeps the battery warm enough to at least start the vehicle when its really cold out.

 

[kpetrov]

If you are talking about main traction battery warming... it is always available even if not warmed.
You should be worry about your 12V battery to start the vehicle, but warming it (not available) has noting to do with vehicle being plugged or not.

 

[Hasenphever]

I'm asking because on Lon12's previous posts about in this thread about it being too cold for the EV battery to even start the vehicle.

Does anyone know if level 1 charging keeps the EV battery warm enough to avoid the battery too cold situation?

 

[Lon12]

Exactly. The software is not letting the car start below a set battery temperature. The Bolt has the same issue. If I let it sit outside and cold soaked below -30ºC I get the dreaded "Battery Too Cold Plug in to Warm" message. So you better be parked close to an outlet or you are not going anywhere. You would think the engineers could at least give you a few watts of power to move the car to the closest outlet to heat it up. Other EVs let you drive with a cold battery but at reduced power.

I'm pretty sure the 12V on the PHEV is not used to start the ICE.

 

[littlescrote]

I'm pretty sure the 12V on the PHEV is not used to start the ICE.

It's definitely not. The traction battery starts the engine via the generator (working as a motor, obviously).

 

[kpetrov]

Yep the 12V battery is just starting the system.
On north-American gen.3 models for sure there are PTC heater elements in the battery compartment that works bellow -20C so better be plugged in.
There are PTC heater fuses under the hood and it is in the manual as well.

Just once I had "battery to cold" message at -22C but only for preheating the vehicle with the app, the ICE started.

 

[Hasenphever]

On north-American gen.3 models for sure there are PTC heater elements in the battery compartment that works bellow -20C so better be plugged in.

Do you know if a level 1 evse will turn the PTC heater elements on when needed?

 

[kpetrov]

On north-American gen.3 models for sure there are PTC heater elements in the battery compartment that works bellow -20C so better be plugged in.

Do you know if a level 1 evse will turn the PTC heater elements on when needed?

There was some specific for cold charging but cant find it.

This is what I have found in the manual:

General information 2-11
On vehicles equipped with both MITSUBISHI Remote control and electric heater, if a low temperature is predicted and even if the drive battery is fully charged, connect EV charging cable beforehand. The drive battery is automatically warmed up.

 

[Lon12]

On north-American gen.3 models for sure there are PTC heater elements in the battery compartment that works bellow -20C so better be plugged in.

Do you know if a level 1 evse will turn the PTC heater elements on when needed?

There was some specific for cold charging but cant find it.

This is what I have found in the manual:

General information 2-11
On vehicles equipped with both MITSUBISHI Remote control and electric heater, if a low temperature is predicted and even if the drive battery is fully charged, connect EV charging cable beforehand. The drive battery is automatically warmed up.

Is this from your 2018 owners manual? We are trying to find out more about how the 2023 model works. The spec. sheet does indicate that the battery has both heating and cooling capabilities while charging but I can't find any information about the system. We had to settle for an SEL and will get it next week. The dealership has only received two GTs since November and has no indication of when another GT will arrive. They blame the chip shortage for the lack of GTs.
I will try and update this thread with cold weather performance that I see when we get our next cold snap. The weather forecasters are saying the "Polar Vortex" might make another appearance over North America in a week or so.

 

[Hasenphever]

Is this from your 2018 owners manual? We are trying to find out more about how the 2023 model works. The spec. sheet does indicate that the battery has both heating and cooling capabilities while charging but I can't find any information about the system. We had to settle for an SEL and will get it next week. The dealership has only received two GTs since November and has no indication of when another GT will arrive. They blame the chip shortage for the lack of GTs.
I will try and update this thread with cold weather performance that I see when we get our next cold snap. The weather forecasters are saying the "Polar Vortex" might make another appearance over North America in a week or so.

I checked the 2023 manual and could not find the same info about the warmers, but there were a mentions of using the a/c system to cool the battery.

Also the 12v aux battery is needed to start the vehicle.

 

[Lon12]

Yes. 12v to start the vehicle. But does not start the engine. Starter generator is high voltage.