2019 Outlander PHEV reviews and what we know

[user 816]

Wired UK review out: http://www.wired.co.uk/article/mitsubishi-outlander-phev-2019-review

One component they particularly criticize is the GKN eTransmission, and the overall tone of the review leans toward the negative.

Improved insulation against noise and vibration makes new Outlander PHEV a relaxing place to sit and it remains quiet at motorway speeds, so long as the driver goes easy on the throttle inputs. It's only the engine/gearbox combo that spoils the peace and tranquillity from inside, with the “Multimode eTransmission” occasionally holding on to gears for far too long and allowing a jarring, monotonous engine note to leak into the cabin.

We only experienced this when the engine was under particularly heavy loads, such as climbing steep hills or attempting to perform a quick overtraining manoeuvre, but it was unpleasant nonetheless.

Its quite scary when a reviewer clearly has no understanding of the car at all. All the talk of gears is nonsense, it doesn't have a gearbox (apart from one constant fixed ratio)
It is not holding a gear, its constant engine note is because the engine is working as an independent electrical generator and therefore holds the steady speed for best efficiency to make the most current.
As soon as power requirement on the vehicle reduces the engine either reduces its set speed or shuts off altogether and runs on the charge its put in the battery or runs in parallel mode and matches engine speed to road speed whilst pulling the car through an electronic clutch.

Any car makes more engine noise under hard load, the only difference in the PHEV is its engine may run at a fixed speed not directly related to road speed. If someone finds that more annoying, then they are an *****.

 

[ChrisMiller]

I'd trust a Wired car review about as much as an Autocar review of a laptop. Wired used to aspire to be the house magazine of Silicon Valley - these days, heaven knows what it's trying to be.

 

[robdickinson]

I honestly dont know what would please them?

The volvo xc90 phev is £60-70k isn it?
Range Rover Sport Hybrid is £70k up
The BMW X5 XDrive40e is 'cheap' at £56k but only 18 miles of ev range.

Cheapest outlander phev is £32k

But yes lets complain the Mitsubishi isnt as good as a car costing twice as much.

 

[Woodman411]

I honestly dont know what would please them?

The volvo xc90 phev is £60-70k isn it?
Range Rover Sport Hybrid is £70k up
The BMW X5 XDrive40e is 'cheap' at £56k but only 18 miles of ev range.

Cheapest outlander phev is £32k

But yes lets complain the Mitsubishi isnt as good as a car costing twice as much.

I'm curious how the Outlander compares to other PHEV's in the same price range in regards to ICE-turn-on NVH. For example, Car and Driver says about the Chevy Volt ICE turn-on:

Once the battery is tapped out, the 101-hp engine fires up to drive the front wheels and recharge the lithium-ion cells, with help from the motor/generators. This occurs so gently that it’s easy to miss the subtle shudder when combustion kicks in.

https://www.caranddriver.com/chevrolet/volt

I've never heard the Outlander's ICE turn-on described like this. So is this a fair criticism, do other PHEV's in this price range do better with ICE turn-on? (other PHEV's in the USA market around the $30,000 price point include Chevy Volt, Ford Fusion (aka Mondeo), Kia Niro, and Toyota Prius Prime).

 

[robdickinson]

I dont think the phev's ice is very subtle or quiet, its quite gnarly when running but even then cruising around in a 50km city its unobtrusive.

the volt never seen one, its a bit more ev than ice compared to the outlander, bigger battery smaller engine

But in truth the 3 you have listed are all 2wd saloon cars , comparing against an suv like the outlander is irrelevant IMO, if I didnt need the 4wd suv aspect I'd have something else...

 

[Woodman411]

I dont think the phev's ice is very subtle or quiet, its quite gnarly when running but even then cruising around in a 50km city its unobtrusive.

the volt never seen one, its a bit more ev than ice compared to the outlander, bigger battery smaller engine

But in truth the 3 you have listed are all 2wd saloon cars , comparing against an suv like the outlander is irrelevant IMO, if I didnt need the 4wd suv aspect I'd have something else...

Based on the above logic, one could dismiss any and all criticism against the Outlander PHEV, since it is the only SUV PHEV in its price range. To mitigate that reality and provide a somewhat fair basis for comparison, is the reason why my question was very targeted, the specific PHEV operation for ICE turn-on NVH.

 

[jaapv]

Wired UK review out: http://www.wired.co.uk/article/mitsubishi-outlander-phev-2019-review

One component they particularly criticize is the GKN eTransmission, and the overall tone of the review leans toward the negative.

Improved insulation against noise and vibration makes new Outlander PHEV a relaxing place to sit and it remains quiet at motorway speeds, so long as the driver goes easy on the throttle inputs. It's only the engine/gearbox combo that spoils the peace and tranquillity from inside, with the “Multimode eTransmission” occasionally holding on to gears for far too long and allowing a jarring, monotonous engine note to leak into the cabin.

We only experienced this when the engine was under particularly heavy loads, such as climbing steep hills or attempting to perform a quick overtraining manoeuvre, but it was unpleasant nonetheless.

Its quite scary when a reviewer clearly has no understanding of the car at all. All the talk of gears is nonsense, it doesn't have a gearbox (apart from one constant fixed ratio)
It is not holding a gear, its constant engine note is because the engine is working as an independent electrical generator and therefore holds the steady speed for best efficiency to make the most current.
As soon as power requirement on the vehicle reduces the engine either reduces its set speed or shuts off altogether and runs on the charge its put in the battery or runs in parallel mode and matches engine speed to road speed whilst pulling the car through an electronic clutch.

Any car makes more engine noise under hard load, the only difference in the PHEV is its engine may run at a fixed speed not directly related to road speed. If someone finds that more annoying, then they are an *****.

Quite agree. It takes a bit of getting used to that the engine revs are linked to load rather than speed and gear ratio. Nobody thinks it strange that an automatic is noisy when accelerating with kick-down.

 

[ThudnBlundr]

I would hope that the transmission holds on to a gear - it only has one :roll:

 

[anko]

[It is not holding a gear, its constant engine note is because the engine is working as an independent electrical generator and therefore holds the steady speed for best efficiency to make the most current.

While driving (in serial mode) the ICE hardly sticks to a steady speed. I think what they refer to is the high revving. This high revving is not a result of maximising efficiency but a result of producing enough power to saturate the generator (70 kW output of the ICE @ 4100 RPM results in 60 kW output of the generator).

 

[Woodman411]

https://www.bangkokpost.com/auto/news/1495862/mitsubishi-stays-committed-to-thai-ev-drive

When describing the 2019 Outlander PHEV, Toshinaga Kato, vice executive officer of Mitsubishi's Asean division, was quoted as saying:

"A battery can last for up to eight years if it is carefully used," he said.

Wouldn't we love for him to expound what he means by "carefully used"? In the USA, Mitsubishi warrants the PHEV components to 100,000 miles or 10 years, whichever comes first. I'm curious if by year 9 or 10, they will replace the drive-battery under warranty, but something tells me that is unlikely.

 

[greendwarf]

I honestly dont know what would please them?

The volvo xc90 phev is £60-70k isn it?
Range Rover Sport Hybrid is £70k up
The BMW X5 XDrive40e is 'cheap' at £56k but only 18 miles of ev range.

Cheapest outlander phev is £32k

But yes lets complain the Mitsubishi isnt as good as a car costing twice as much.

I'm curious how the Outlander compares to other PHEV's in the same price range in regards to ICE-turn-on NVH. For example, Car and Driver says about the Chevy Volt ICE turn-on:

Once the battery is tapped out, the 101-hp engine fires up to drive the front wheels and recharge the lithium-ion cells, with help from the motor/generators. This occurs so gently that it’s easy to miss the subtle shudder when combustion kicks in.

https://www.caranddriver.com/chevrolet/volt

I've never heard the Outlander's ICE turn-on described like this. So is this a fair criticism, do other PHEV's in this price range do better with ICE turn-on? (other PHEV's in the USA market around the $30,000 price point include Chevy Volt, Ford Fusion (aka Mondeo), Kia Niro, and Toyota Prius Prime).

Perhaps I'm just getting deaf or have the radio turned up too loud :lol: but I can never detect the ice kicking in when the battery is depleted (even though I try). I usually only first notice it due to a slight vibration through the steering wheel.

 

[ChrisMiller]

Perhaps I'm just getting deaf or have the radio turned up too loud :lol: but I can never detect the ice kicking in when the battery is depleted (even though I try). I usually only first notice it due to a slight vibration through the steering wheel.

Me too. But, of course, if the ICE comes on because you've floored the accelerator to get up a hill, you'll definitely hear it

 

[Woodman411]

Perhaps I'm just getting deaf or have the radio turned up too loud :lol: but I can never detect the ice kicking in when the battery is depleted (even though I try). I usually only first notice it due to a slight vibration through the steering wheel.

Me too. But, of course, if the ICE comes on because you've floored the accelerator to get up a hill, you'll definitely hear it

Good point: ICE-turn-on-NVH for series versus parallel modes. Most likely the Car and Driver review of the Chevy Volt was describing series mode. It would be helpful if PHEV reviews would compare NVH between the two modes (we all know EV mode is quiet and smooth), or at least specify which mode they're describing.

 

[jaapv]

Perhaps I'm just getting deaf or have the radio turned up too loud :lol: but I can never detect the ice kicking in when the battery is depleted (even though I try). I usually only first notice it due to a slight vibration through the steering wheel.

Me too. But, of course, if the ICE comes on because you've floored the accelerator to get up a hill, you'll definitely hear it

Yes, but when I go up a hill in the necessary low gear in a conventional car, the engine is not exactly silent either.

 

[ChrisMiller]

Yes, but when I go up a hill in the necessary low gear in a conventional car, the engine is not exactly silent either.

I think the impression that the engine is 'loud' when under heavy load is generated by contrast with the relative silence of electric mode*. I doubt that an accurate measurement of dB levels would reveal that the PHEV is any louder than a Range Rover or X5 in similar conditions.

* It also sounds 'odd' to someone used to a mechanical or hydraulic transmission, because (in serial mode) there's no relation between engine revs and speed.

 

[greendwarf]

Perhaps I'm just getting deaf or have the radio turned up too loud :lol: but I can never detect the ice kicking in when the battery is depleted (even though I try). I usually only first notice it due to a slight vibration through the steering wheel.

Me too. But, of course, if the ICE comes on because you've floored the accelerator to get up a hill, you'll definitely hear it

Despite living in the Sarf Lundun Alps there is little by the way of real hills to try this out :lol: :lol:

 

[ckrs]

I have the Ford Fusion too and compared to the Outlander, the ICE turn on in the Fusion is more noticeable than the Outlander. But on the Fusion, when the ICE is at max power it is much quieter than the Outlander at max power. The Fusion at max power is still louder than standard ICE versions, but much better than the Outlander.

Another comparisons to the Fusion is the performance on hills. I live in a hilly area, and while going up longer hills the Fusion ICE turns to prevent electric motor/battery from overheating (I think that is the reason). This rarely happens on the Outlander on those same hills. The ICE on the Outlander rarely turns on, and only does so when trying to accelerate quickly up the hill.

Also the Outlander range in driving around the hills is much closer to the stated EV Range value than is the Fusion. I believe this might be because of higher power regen available in the Outlander.

In summary, I feel the PHEV behavior is better on the Outlander than the Fusion. I prefer it to remain in EV mode longer so I can cover most of my trips in EV mode. Also I rarely am in Max ICE power mode on the Outlander. If I see the battery getting low, I put it in charge mode when on the freeway to save the battery for the final leg of the trip.

 

[Woodman411]

I have the Ford Fusion too and compared to the Outlander, the ICE turn on in the Fusion is more noticeable than the Outlander. But on the Fusion, when the ICE is at max power it is much quieter than the Outlander at max power. The Fusion at max power is still louder than standard ICE versions, but much better than the Outlander.

Another comparisons to the Fusion is the performance on hills. I live in a hilly area, and while going up longer hills the Fusion ICE turns to prevent electric motor/battery from overheating (I think that is the reason). This rarely happens on the Outlander on those same hills. The ICE on the Outlander rarely turns on, and only does so when trying to accelerate quickly up the hill.

Also the Outlander range in driving around the hills is much closer to the stated EV Range value than is the Fusion. I believe this might be because of higher power regen available in the Outlander.

In summary, I feel the PHEV behavior is better on the Outlander than the Fusion. I prefer it to remain in EV mode longer so I can cover most of my trips in EV mode. Also I rarely am in Max ICE power mode on the Outlander. If I see the battery getting low, I put it in charge mode when on the freeway to save the battery for the final leg of the trip.

Thank you for this comparison. Although I have already decided on the Outlander PHEV, I was still curious how it compares to other PHEVs in the way it drives, and this was helpful in understanding that.

 

[user 2883]

Had a Ford Escape Hybrid (2005) and the Outlander is way quieter and smoother in hybrid mode. The Ford and Toyota hybrids have to start the ICE up above a certain speed as to prevent overspeeding the motor-generator (MG2 in Toyota speak). This is due to the nature of the Power Split Device hybrid drivetrain both manufacturers use.

While driving in and out of the Coast Range mountains during the recent holiday the ICE in the Outlander was barely noticeable over tire/road noise. The Ford would have been revving into the 3000+ RPM range to make speed under similar conditions.

 

[Woodman411]

2019 non-PHEV Outlander has now shown up on Mitsu Australia: https://www.mitsubishi-motors.com.au/vehicles/outlander

Based on the non-PHEV's trim levels, one can get an idea of what items are standard and what are only available on a higher trim. The assumptions below are based on USA trim levels SEL and GT. Will probably vary by region:

Standard:
- updated front fascia
- updated rear lower bumper
- 18" wheel design (most likely)
- silver fog light housing (most likely)
- most if not all of the interior updates

Higher Trim only:
- updated headlight design, LED only, halogen projector design looks identical to MY2018
- large rear spoiler (interestingly, the optional rear spoiler is the same as MY2018, meaning it does not have the center indent. Could be a website mistake, or it could be that there are now simply two versions of the large rear spoiler)