Remote Electric Heating Question

[user 258]

I usually charge from a 16Amp point at home and the charge is always complete in 3 hrs or so - using the pre-heat triggers the charge indication ( on the remote App ) within a few minutes of the pre-heat turning off the charge indication also turns off... leaving the battery fully charged.

Exactly, but on the 10 A charger it is different, as that cannot supply sufficient power

Just noticed this.
There is no difference between the 10A and 16A charger in this respect. The problem with using the battery instead of mains relates to having the charger set to timer mode. After it charges it switches to "waiting to charge" and then seems unable to use mains for preheat even if you are still within the charge time period.
Kind regards,
Mark

 

[maby]

I usually charge from a 16Amp point at home and the charge is always complete in 3 hrs or so - using the pre-heat triggers the charge indication ( on the remote App ) within a few minutes of the pre-heat turning off the charge indication also turns off... leaving the battery fully charged.

Exactly, but on the 10 A charger it is different, as that cannot supply sufficient power

Just noticed this.
There is no difference between the 10A and 16A charger in this respect. The problem with using the battery instead of mains relates to having the charger set to timer mode. After it charges it switches to "waiting to charge" and then seems unable to use mains for preheat even if you are still within the charge time period.
Kind regards,
Mark

There is some difference, you know. 16A at 250v (ok, I know that we have 240!) is 4kW whereas 10A is 2.5kW - hence the charger cannot supply sufficient current to run the heater when plugged up to a 10A connector and will draw down the battery a bit. On a 16A socket, the charger can supply almost all the power the heater wants, so the drain on the battery will be very small.

 

[user 258]

I usually charge from a 16Amp point at home and the charge is always complete in 3 hrs or so - using the pre-heat triggers the charge indication ( on the remote App ) within a few minutes of the pre-heat turning off the charge indication also turns off... leaving the battery fully charged.
Exactly, but on the 10 A charger it is different, as that cannot supply sufficient power

Just noticed this.
There is no difference between the 10A and 16A charger in this respect. The problem with using the battery instead of mains relates to having the charger set to timer mode. After it charges it switches to "waiting to charge" and then seems unable to use mains for preheat even if you are still within the charge time period.
Kind regards,
Mark

There is some difference, you know. 16A at 250v (ok, I know that we have 240!) is 4kW whereas 10A is 2.5kW - hence the charger cannot supply sufficient current to run the heater when plugged up to a 10A connector and will draw down the battery a bit. On a 16A socket, the charger can supply almost all the power the heater wants, so the drain on the battery will be very small.

Hi,
I understand that a 16A charge point will supply more than a 10A charger. I also accept that with a 10A charger it will drain the battery a little (mains is 2.75KW and heater is 4KW). The previous problem was that it wouldn't draw any power from the mains at all. It all came from the battery. Now, without using the charging timer, it starts drawing from the mains as soon as the heater switches on. This I am happy with
Kind regards,
Mark

 

[Hypermiler]

Avensys
Just to be clear then, so I don't have to do any experimenting - if we want to use the preheating option without depleting the battery we have to have no charging timers set at all even if charging is set to be on at the preheat time? That is surely a bug they need to fix and we need to report back. I time my charging for after the evening peak (to be a good citizen) but would want heating in the morning from the 16amp charger.
Cheers
H

 

[Hypermiler]

Ok, just seen your other post about this. That's a bit rubbish and needs to be sorted out!
Cheers
H

 

[user 258]

Ok, just seen your other post about this. That's a bit rubbish and needs to be sorted out!
Cheers
H

hi,
Agreed. I could do with someone testing it though to make sure they replicate my findings. I would then ask my dealer to take it up with Mitsubishi.
Kind regards,
Mark

 

[ufo]

Avensys,

Your theory is wrong at least for Aussie spec vehicles (there seems to be many differences between AU and EU spec models). I have never used timed charging and can only use 10 Amp (no option with AU spec models for 16 AMP) it always consumes the battery and you have to wait about half an hour for battery to be topped up to full from mains.

 

[user 258]

Avensys,

Your theory is wrong at least for Aussie spec vehicles (there seems to be many differences between AU and EU spec models). I have never used timed charging and can only use 10 Amp (no option with AU spec models for 16 AMP) it always consumes the battery and you have to wait about half an hour for battery to be topped up to full from mains.

Hi,

I don't actually think we disagree on anything. With a 10A charger (2.75KW) it doesn't provide enough power to heat the car from mains alone as the heater is 4KW. The difference must come from the battery. This will leave the battery slightly discharged after heating. If you leave the car plugged into the mains after the heating has stopped then it will recharge the slightly discharged battery. Remember it charges at a reduced rate as the battery approaches full so it shouldn't be 30 minutes at full power to recharge the car.

The issue I was describing was that ALL heating came from the battery if you use the charge timer leaving a significantly more discharged battery.

I started a new topic for the charging timer bug at http://www.myoutlanderphev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=569

Kind regards,
Mark

 

[thegurio]

Avensys,

Your theory is wrong at least for Aussie spec vehicles (there seems to be many differences between AU and EU spec models). I have never used timed charging and can only use 10 Amp (no option with AU spec models for 16 AMP) it always consumes the battery and you have to wait about half an hour for battery to be topped up to full from mains.

Just to clarify, our chargers are 15 amp Ufo, that's why we have the big earth terminal on it. The only way to take it down to 10 amp is to either cut the end off and put a 10 amp (or normal plug) on the end of it, or do what I do and use a caravan plug to 'convert' it...

 

[user 258]

Hi,
In the UK our standard sockets are all rated at 13A. Using a power meter while charging shows 11.07A, 256V, and 2800W.
Kind regards,
Mark

 

[ufo]

Thanks for clarification and responses. I really wonder why MM did not provide 15 Amp option for AU spec models at all.

 

[edsun]

I am new here. Just had my PHEV 10 days, and had a 16amp socket fitted today. Can I set the Remote Electric Heating solely using the MMCS, or do I have to have a telephone connected? I think, using the MMCS, I have set it to start at 7.20am every week day morning, but will this happen?

 

[edsun]

......had a 16amp socket fitted today. Can I set the Remote Electric Heating solely using the MMCS, or do I have to have a telephone connected? I think, using the MMCS, I have set it to start at 7.20am every week day morning, but will this happen?

It worked. Heating set using just the MMCS. Also, with 16amp charger attached, battery was full after the 'pre-heat'.

 

[anko]

Was full or appeared full? SOC can drop a few points before it becomes visible. Graphs I posted yesterday suggest power consumption of 4800 watt by the heater, where the charger will not supply more than 3300 watts from the grid. So, unless power consumption by the heater has been reduced for MY16 (during pre-heating at least), I would think your battery could not have been full ...

 

[westdevon]

When I had a diesel car, on a really cold day I would nip out and start the car to let it defrost. How much is that likely to cost in diesel compared to using the battery? 4kw seems massive to me. I've sat in the car with 2.4 kW fanheater on an extension lead as an experiment, and its sweltering in 5 minutes.

 

[Regulo]

A fan heater directly heats the air passing over red hot electrical elements, the car heater uses electric elements (like your electric kettle elements) to heat water, which then circulates through the matrix to supply heat. It will never be as efficient as a fan heater.

 

[jamerg]

Avensys,

Your theory is wrong at least for Aussie spec vehicles (there seems to be many differences between AU and EU spec models). I have never used timed charging and can only use 10 Amp (no option with AU spec models for 16 AMP) it always consumes the battery and you have to wait about half an hour for battery to be topped up to full from mains.

Hi,

I don't actually think we disagree on anything. With a 10A charger (2.75KW) it doesn't provide enough power to heat the car from mains alone as the heater is 4KW. The difference must come from the battery. This will leave the battery slightly discharged after heating. If you leave the car plugged into the mains after the heating has stopped then it will recharge the slightly discharged battery. Remember it charges at a reduced rate as the battery approaches full so it shouldn't be 30 minutes at full power to recharge the car.

The issue I was describing was that ALL heating came from the battery if you use the charge timer leaving a significantly more discharged battery.

I started a new topic for the charging timer bug at http://www.myoutlanderphev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=569

Kind regards,
Mark

Hi Mark

Do you know whether Mitsubishi ever sorted out this bug? I want to charge my car overnight but pre-heat it with minimal battery loss which, as I understand it, wasn't possible because of the bug (even if you set your charge time to a time after you intend to heat it, assuming it will have fully charged before then).

Rather annoying if they haven't sorted this out...

 

[TimSmith]

Please accept my apologies if this has been asked before... Is it possible to set the remote heater if the vehicle is NOT on charge?

I've tried to set it from the console inside the vehicle but without success. Must I use the app and will it work even if the vehicle is not plugged in?

Many thanks for any advice.

Cheers,

Tim.

 

[maby]

Please accept my apologies if this has been asked before... Is it possible to set the remote heater if the vehicle is NOT on charge?

I've tried to set it from the console inside the vehicle but without success. Must I use the app and will it work even if the vehicle is not plugged in?

Many thanks for any advice.

Cheers,

Tim.

Yes, it is possible, and yes, you must use the app.

 

[anko]

Must say I haven't tried, but why would you have yo use the app and not MMCS to schedule pre heating?
And why would it depend on whether that car is hooked up to the mains or not?

I assume you do not mean that "using the console" and "remote" are kinda contradicting? :mrgreen: