Had the car 2 months now 1500 miles .Went into dealer re battery range. Dealer says the car is within range. They say they managed to get 28 miles out of the battery. Don't Know how? They never said. I can only manage 21 to 24.5. Driving as light footed as possible. Not impressed .Don't know what it will be like in depth of winter. Wish I'd read some of the comments on this forum before I bought.
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low battery range
- Thread starter sandy
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The short range of the batteries relative to what can be achieved in a regular petrol or diesel car makes people more sensitive to what they achieve. After a while you realise that there is a reason why the range you get on batteries varies and there is always a reason so far in my experience. What I have come to realise is that variation was also there when I drove a pure petrol or diesel too it is just that I did not monitor my MPG constantly over the last twenty miles.
What I have certainly realised is that hills make for high MPG/electricity usage. Should have been obvious from memory of how much effort it was to cycle up hills versus on the flat but that memory was dulled by the long range fuel tank in cars and not constantly monitoring MPG.
CJ
What I have certainly realised is that hills make for high MPG/electricity usage. Should have been obvious from memory of how much effort it was to cycle up hills versus on the flat but that memory was dulled by the long range fuel tank in cars and not constantly monitoring MPG.
CJ
It's also worth bearing in mind that the difference between an EV range of 21 miles and 30 miles only has a significant effect on the overall running costs for short distance journeys. Within the limits of your EV range, running on electricity works out something like four times cheaper than on petrol but that only applies for quite short distances, so the actual saving in your budget is small. Once you get up to long distances - in excess of 60 or 70 miles - the cost of the section running on petrol drowns out the saving made on electricity and a difference in EV range between 21 miles and 30 miles only results in a difference in price per mile of around one penny on a figure of around 10 to 12 pence per mile.
An EV range of around 22 miles is not at all bad this time of year. It will get better next spring as the temperature climbs, the days get longer and we need less heating and less hours on headlights.
An EV range of around 22 miles is not at all bad this time of year. It will get better next spring as the temperature climbs, the days get longer and we need less heating and less hours on headlights.
jaapv
Well-known member
I think it is impossible to introduce the cost of electricity as a meaningful factor. Some pay nothing - either by solar panels or a share in a wind turbine (investment costs?) or by using free charging points, some have an advantageous contract ( I pay 6.53 Eurocent presently) others get screwed by the electricity company... :roll:
jaapv said:
Quite true, but the point I was trying to make is that a difference of a few miles in EV range only really has a small impact on the cost of ownership. It can make a significant difference to the cost per mile on short journeys, but since they are short journeys, the actual impact on your bank balance is a pound or less. As soon as you go significantly beyond your EV range, the cost of petrol drowns out the cost of electricity and the real impact of 21 miles vs. 30 miles of EV range is not very much. At the price of petrol in Britain and the price per KWh most of us are paying here, the cost difference on a 100 mile journey is not much more than a pound.
RazMan
Well-known member
I think that a range of 20 miles or so is acceptable on normal roads, using lights, heat, aircon etc - the theoretical 32 miles MIGHT be achievable on a flat road (with the wind behind you :lol: ) but it is optimistic to say the least!
If you are mostly doing local journeys, commuting to work, shopping etc, and are able to recharge easily then it is surely a whole lot cheaper than petrol isn't it? For example I commute 16 miles to work so I use a little petrol on my return journey, however most of my local journeys are under 20 miles and I stick the car on charge each time I return home. 300 miles so far and my petrol gauge has hardly moved from the 'full' mark - my old Mercedes ML270 would have needed £100 of diesel to do that!
Obviously there is an unseen extra in the kWh required to charge the battery but (if we are to believe all of the hyper blurb) that is about £0.60 per charge - the equivalent to about 0.4 litres of jungle juice.
If however, I go and visit my family who live 100 miles away, I will probably get 50 mpg (ish) which isn't too bad considering it is a 2 ton SUV.
Horses for courses I guess
If you are mostly doing local journeys, commuting to work, shopping etc, and are able to recharge easily then it is surely a whole lot cheaper than petrol isn't it? For example I commute 16 miles to work so I use a little petrol on my return journey, however most of my local journeys are under 20 miles and I stick the car on charge each time I return home. 300 miles so far and my petrol gauge has hardly moved from the 'full' mark - my old Mercedes ML270 would have needed £100 of diesel to do that!
Obviously there is an unseen extra in the kWh required to charge the battery but (if we are to believe all of the hyper blurb) that is about £0.60 per charge - the equivalent to about 0.4 litres of jungle juice.If however, I go and visit my family who live 100 miles away, I will probably get 50 mpg (ish) which isn't too bad considering it is a 2 ton SUV.
Horses for courses I guess
£0.60 per charge is optimistic in the UK, at least. A full charge will take between 10 and 12 KWh - over a pound on any standard tariff. If you are on Economy 7, you might get it down to around 60 pence, but the cost of your day rate electricity will be a fair bit more expensive and the overall cost effectiveness tends to not make sense unless you have storage heaters.
greendwarf
Well-known member
.maby said:
And it all depends on your costs before. Just before I got the PHEV I recorded the consumption of my Avensis in London and a trip down to Folkestone - fairly typical usage. Consumption under 30 mpg so around 20p per mile, whereas even paying £2 to get 20 miles EV is only 10p per mile. If I was to do all my 7000 miles a year on EV then I'm £700 in pocket plus £200 road fund saving. All this neatly saves the £900 loss of interest on the £28k I paid for the car - plus I have a brand new car.
What will be interesting is what consumption I can get with the ICE only - if 40mpg then its 15p per mile, so I'm only saving 5p per mile.
So probably the overall cost with my typical usage and funding will be negative but I still have the new car - so I'm happy.
NB. As a good accountant the savings are calculated on the low side and the costs on the high, so don't get too picky
I own a 90 mile(75 usable), Nissan Leaf and love it. I've gone 32,000 km in 18 months in Canada, a few hours and charges at a time between work tasks and home charges. My wife wants an EV too (Bolt, Tesla3, Volt (too small), or Outlander ? I feel none of the current offerings have a long enough range to be electric power only conveniently yet. So the Outlander PHEV's has an appeal, a hatchback/SUV for our trips.
Why, Why, Why does no-one but Volt (50 miles, all usable), have a more robust battery and range ? A PHEV with 80-100 miles EV range would give 90 %+ E only use for most weekly users, and still shine in long range option with gas (or EV top up if handy) use ? I know it's a balance of cost and weight, but offer it as an option to order. Just my 2 cents, or $2,000 we would gladly spend as an option on a Mitsubishi PHEV Hatch/CUV with + seamless gas when needed, for our second highway range car.
Why, Why, Why does no-one but Volt (50 miles, all usable), have a more robust battery and range ? A PHEV with 80-100 miles EV range would give 90 %+ E only use for most weekly users, and still shine in long range option with gas (or EV top up if handy) use ? I know it's a balance of cost and weight, but offer it as an option to order. Just my 2 cents, or $2,000 we would gladly spend as an option on a Mitsubishi PHEV Hatch/CUV with + seamless gas when needed, for our second highway range car.
maby said:
Just to be pedantic... there is no way you will use 12kWh to charge it.
between 9 and 10, maybe. More likely less than 9.
The battery generally discharges to around 30%, sometimes a bit lower, but never less than 26% in normal use.
So, from 30% charge (3.6kWh) back to 12 would take 8.4 (without losses, which seem to be quite low).
sandy said:
Possibly it is within range ... but on the lower bandwidth
When considering EV range the speed is very important .. above 80km/h the PHEV does consume a lot of electricity per each km travel.
I get 5 ECO score only if in my trip not only I'm very light on the accelerator pedal, but as well, without exceeding 45km/h
With 4 ECO score that means an average speed of 60km/h and never over 80km/h .. I can mange at best 45km range in summer time .. that is around the 28miles that your dealer did managed, but possibly at low speed.
This means that either you got an unlucky battery pack, or some strange firmware setting ... or maybe your PHEV has some extra rolling resistance
But as well .. if the dealer achieved 28mile with only 4 ECO scores ... then .. possibly your car is just fine.
Also .. notice that id you have AC on it will effectively reduce the EV range .. AC does consume ~1kw .. and driving at slow speed it really impact on the range ... possibly not as bad as the estimated EV range that in my case with AC on does shows 10km less range then by clicking on AC off .. but still the difference in EV range is sensible
