Change to 100% or 80%?

[drwho]

Hi all. I've been charging the battery on my 2024 Outlander PHEV to only 80 or 90% as that's what I've read is good for the battery. What the battery registers when I put it on charge is anywhere between almost zero, up to 30%.
This was the general information that I have gleaned from research, but one of the members here posted that the Mitsubishi battery has hidden charge elements, so that when we charge it to 100%, it is really only charged to 80%, and the 20% safety zone is hidden from us. They also said, likewise, it never really discharges to zero so that when it reads 0% there is still some charge left in the battery in order to protect it. It doesn't really matter to me which scenario is correct, I just need to know which scenario IS correct.
Until we get some definite information on this, I will continue charging to 80 or 90%. Occasionally, I charge it to 100% as I've also read that charging it to 100% balances the battery cells. But again, who really knows?
I would appreciate any information on this from someone who knows the correct info just to verify what I've read and what has been posted here already.
Thanks,
Dave

 

[PHEV07]

Hi all. I've been charging the battery on my 2024 Outlander PHEV to only 80 or 90% as that's what I've read is good for the battery. What the battery registers when I put it on charge is anywhere between almost zero, up to 30%.
This was the general information that I have gleaned from research, but one of the members here posted that the Mitsubishi battery has hidden charge elements, so that when we charge it to 100%, it is really only charged to 80%, and the 20% safety zone is hidden from us. They also said, likewise, it never really discharges to zero so that when it reads 0% there is still some charge left in the battery in order to protect it. It doesn't really matter to me which scenario is correct, I just need to know which scenario IS correct.
Until we get some definite information on this, I will continue charging to 80 or 90%. Occasionally, I charge it to 100% as I've also read that charging it to 100% balances the battery cells. But again, who really knows?
I would appreciate any information on this from someone who knows the correct info just to verify what I've read and what has been posted here already.
Thanks,
Dave

Very good question Dave.

I also have wondered what may be best for the Drive Battery for our Mitsubishi.

From what I have read, it does appear that for the LiO Battery charging from 20 - 80% is recommended but as you have pointed out from info related by Mitsubishi Members where they have indicated that Mitsubishi software does not allow the Battery to be fully discharged or charged for 100% but I do not know what the limit parameters are.

What I do know for a fact, as I had confirmed when using the PHEV Watchdog on both my previous 2018 and 2022, the Computer reduced the SOH after each charge by .01% after each charge, regardless of how much the Battery was Charged or Discharged.

On my 2018, after 2 years my SOC did drop to 67% of SOH requiring Rebalancing which cost me close to $480. This procedure did bring the SOC back to 88% of new but within 6 months dropped it had dropped down to 70%.

This is the main reason that upgraded to a 2022, some 3 1/2 years after leasing my 2018.

Since the PHEV Watchdog still worked on the 2022, I monitored and found that the Battery on the 2022 was also showing a depletion of the battery at 0.01% per charge. This was done by the Computer and was not an actual depletion

So when I received my 2024 I was very disappointed to find that the PHEV WATCHDOG no longer worked with the 2023 and 2024 so not knowing if Mitsubishi continued the practice of programing the Computer to show a depletion of the battery by 0.01% per charge as was done before.

So not knowing for certain and not believing that Mitsubishi would change how they Handle the Battery Management System I decided to follow my intuition and charge only when the Battery is near depletion and always charge to full

I need to take my car in for the 6 months Servicing, 1 month late and ask for them to print out what the Drive Battery Current SOH is.

I believe that the SOH may have already dropped because from April 8 till Oct 8th I was able to charge the Battery to show a range of over 100 kms. after Charging.

Since Oct 9th the maximum range is now showing 84 kms. The temperature outside has dropped but still +10'C on average. Similar to the Temperature back during the week of Apr 8, 2024.

I will report the value of my current SOH when I find out what it is after my Service Work this coming week or so.

 

[drwho]

Very good question Dave.

I also have wondered what may be best for the Drive Battery for our Mitsubishi.

From what I have read, it does appear that for the LiO Battery charging from 20 - 80% is recommended but as you have pointed out from info related by Mitsubishi Members where they have indicated that Mitsubishi software does not allow the Battery to be fully discharged or charged for 100% but I do not know what the limit parameters are.

What I do know for a fact, as I had confirmed when using the PHEV Watchdog on both my previous 2018 and 2022, the Computer reduced the SOC after each charge by .01% after each charge, regardless of how much the Battery was Charged or Discharged.

On my 2018, after 2 years my SOC did drop to 67% of SOC requiring Rebalancing which cost me close to $480. This procedure did bring the SOC back to 88% of new but within 6 months dropped it had dropped down to 70%.

This is the main reason that upgraded to a 2022, some 3 1/2 years after leasing my 2018.

Since the PHEV Watchdog still worked on the 2022, I monitored and found that the Battery on the 2022 was also showing a depletion of the battery at 0.01% per charge. This was done by the Computer and was not an actual depletion

So when I received my 2024 I was very disappointed to find that the PHEV WATCHDOG no longer worked with the 2023 and 2024 so not knowing if Mitsubishi continued the practice of programing the Computer to show a depletion of the battery by 0.01% per charge as was done before.

So not knowing for certain and not believing that Mitsubishi would change how they Handle the Battery Management System I decided to follow my intuition and charge only when the Battery is near depletion and always charge to full

I need to take my car in for the 6 months Servicing, 1 month late and ask for them to print out what the Drive Battery Current SOC is.

I believe that the SOC may have already dropped because from April 8 till Oct 8th I was able to charge the Battery to show a range of over 100 kms. after Charging.

Since Oct 9th the maximum range is now showing 84 kms. The temperature outside has dropped but still +10'C on average. Similar to the Temperature back during the week of Apr 8, 2024.

I will report the value of my current SOC when I find out what it is after my Service Work this coming week or so.

That's some very interesting info. Keep me posted Andre on what you find out after the service. I got mine on July 1st this year so it's not time for a service yet, but went I do take it in, I'll be having a quick chat with the service manager if he's in to ask him about the battery charge limits and whether the indicated charge is actual.
I think it's a good thing that we are going into detail on these things regarding the usage of our Outlanders, as they are a fairly new technology which is advancing even further as we write and a solid understanding of it is much better than the guesswork that most people outside this forum are dealing with.

I find it all very interesting, and dealing with the new tech in this car is kinda fun.
When we tell others about the learning curve, they all say they couldn't possibly be bothered. My wife and I have always been a bit different.

Anyhoo, happy motoring Andre and I'll let you know what my service manager says. I may call my sales guy and arrange a quick visit in the meantime and get some questions answered.
Cheers.

 

[PHEV07]

Hi Dave

I am taking my car in for Servicing this coming Thursday.

Will post update in this Thread.

Andre

 

[Vadym Charkovskyy]

Due to scientific researches any ev battery will last maximum when changing to 75% maximum and recharge no less then 65% , tho keep it between 65 and 75 percent. On other side, if you change ev batt always up to 100 and discharge to zero, it will give you minimum cycles possible. On my own opinion, if you dont have a 10 years warranty on that battery from the manufacturer, keep it charged until 80% and do not discharge completely - it will give you maximum life time! Otherwise just use it normally, because in winter time (especially in Canada) you want to use your Outlander, so keep it connected to the charger all night long to maintain the batt in optimal operable temperature!

 

[barryk689]

Due to scientific researches any ev battery will last maximum when changing to 75% maximum and recharge no less then 65% , tho keep it between 65 and 75 percent. On other side, if you change ev batt always up to 100 and discharge to zero, it will give you minimum cycles possible. On my own opinion, if you dont have a 10 years warranty on that battery from the manufacturer, keep it charged until 80% and do not discharge completely - it will give you maximum life time! Otherwise just use it normally, because in winter time (especially in Canada) you want to use your Outlander, so keep it connected to the charger all night long to maintain the batt in optimal operable temperature!

Battery research says that keeping between 40 and 60% charge is optimal although probably not feasible for most. Also I thought Mitsubishi doesn’t allow a full charge to 100% or depletion past 20%??

 

[Vadym Charkovskyy]

Battery research says that keeping between 40 and 60% charge is optimal although probably not feasible for most. Also I thought Mitsubishi doesn’t allow a full charge to 100% or depletion past 20%??

Well, I know that in Canada it was the problem with PHEV Outlander of the latest generation during the cold winter times car is useless because frozen battery and the Mitsubishi told us to keep the cars plugged in all the time possible and I never seen any information that I am "not allowed" to charge my PHEV 100%. If someone could share any links on official information would be great to read. Thanks

 

[PHEV07]

Very good question Dave.

I also have wondered what may be best for the Drive Battery for our Mitsubishi.

From what I have read, it does appear that for the LiO Battery charging from 20 - 80% is recommended but as you have pointed out from info related by Mitsubishi Members where they have indicated that Mitsubishi software does not allow the Battery to be fully discharged or charged for 100% but I do not know what the limit parameters are.

What I do know for a fact, as I had confirmed when using the PHEV Watchdog on both my previous 2018 and 2022, the Computer reduced the SOH after each charge by .01% after each charge, regardless of how much the Battery was Charged or Discharged.

On my 2018, after 2 years my SOC did drop to 67% of SOH requiring Rebalancing which cost me close to $480. This procedure did bring the SOC back to 88% of new but within 6 months dropped it had dropped down to 70%.

This is the main reason that upgraded to a 2022, some 3 1/2 years after leasing my 2018.

Since the PHEV Watchdog still worked on the 2022, I monitored and found that the Battery on the 2022 was also showing a depletion of the battery at 0.01% per charge. This was done by the Computer and was not an actual depletion

So when I received my 2024 I was very disappointed to find that the PHEV WATCHDOG no longer worked with the 2023 and 2024 so not knowing if Mitsubishi continued the practice of programing the Computer to show a depletion of the battery by 0.01% per charge as was done before.

So not knowing for certain and not believing that Mitsubishi would change how they Handle the Battery Management System I decided to follow my intuition and charge only when the Battery is near depletion and always charge to full

I need to take my car in for the 6 months Servicing, 1 month late and ask for them to print out what the Drive Battery Current SOH is.

I believe that the SOH may have already dropped because from April 8 till Oct 8th I was able to charge the Battery to show a range of over 100 kms. after Charging.

Since Oct 9th the maximum range is now showing 84 kms. The temperature outside has dropped but still +10'C on average. Similar to the Temperature back during the week of Apr 8, 2024.

I will report the value of my current SOH when I find out what it is after my Service Work this coming week or so.

Just a follow up. For the last 4 Full Charges my Maximum SOC is giving me a Range of 83Kms and using Level 2 Charger Maximum time to charge from 3 to 5 kms range left to Full charge is now only 6hrs. Used to be 7 hrs.

Sep 7, 2024

 

[barryk689]

Just a follow up. For the last 4 Full Charges my Maximum SOC is giving me a Range of 83Kms and using Level 2 Charger Maximum time to charge from 3 to 5 kms range left to Full charge is now only 6hrs. Used to be 7 hrs.View attachment 1575View attachment 1576View attachment 1577View attachment 1579

Sep 7, 2024

I appreciate your knowledgeable posts!

 

[HeliNurse]

My 2020 GRS has always been charged to what the car thinks is best using the granny charger, jumped in today and the guessometer shows 51km range. More than happy with that.

 

[Rudra]

I live on a hill (some call it a mountain), leaving home with full battery guessometer announces 71 km.

Arriving at bottom of the hill guessometer is carousing, claims 144 km.. oh really and then I come back up the hill !

I am waiting for the day when our ebullient guessometer gives up being a guessometer.

 

[PHEV07]

I live on a hill (some call it a mountain), leaving home with full battery guessometer announces 71 km.

Arriving at bottom of the hill guessometer is carousing, claims 144 km.. oh really and then I come back up the hill !

I am waiting for the day when our ebullient guessometer gives up being a guessometer.

Yep. That is why they call if a guessometer.

Luckily I do not drive up up or down hills and do try to maintain similar Acceleration and speed when I drive my regular route and can confirm that the actual distance driven is more less 1 to 5 km difference when compared to guessometer.

I have posted several photos of the display showing kms driven, Average Speed, kWh/100kms and hiw much Battery range I have left.

For my last several trips, prior to plugging the Charger and after completion I take screenshots of my Connect Screen and of the driver display on the car prior to resetting the Screen on the Car. As I stated, I am usually 1 to 5 kms off as long as I do not use the Heater or AC or if ICE does not start unexpectedly.

As the Temperature starts to drop and I start using the heater I will continue to monitor my Guessometer Range after Charging and the actual range I get during my drives.


Range