Series Hybrid Mode - Racing Engine question

[ThudnBlundr]

As jaapv says, try it. Regardless of what you may read, the car does switch back to Series. It also switches back to Series when the car says the fuel is low and displays "---" on the range. Not sure I understand why, though...

SWMBO doesn't like driving with "---" range even though there's plenty of fuel left in the tank. I've never managed to put more than 40l into the 45l tank, so I'm missing out on at least an extra 30+ miles (50+km) from each tank, more if I refill when it first happens :roll:

 

[PhevGeorge]

Thank you everyone for your responses (I have been off-line for a week), however this thread is now drifting OFF-Topic.
I've now had the car for 3 months and covered 3000 miles. I fully understand the Series/Parallel Hybrid modes and the requirements behind them and Mitsubishi have made a pretty good attempt of powering a heavy petrol engined car with only a single gear ratio!

I was really hoping that someone (preferrably a PHEV Watchdog user) could confirm that in Series mode, their car also revs the engine, sometimes up to 4000RPM, when gently travelling up a steepish hill between 30 and 40 MPH. Mine does it, it is an awful racket and spoils an otherwise excellent car!

 

[greendwarf]

Simple answer then - Yes

 

[PhevGeorge]

Thank you so much Greendwarf

That is exactly the simple answer I was looking for and means that there is no point in me entering into a dialogue with the Mitsubishi dealer that I purchased the car from last November - No one wants un-necessary trips to a Dealer!

I just need to dream about an "Engine Kill" or "Engine restrict to " 2K RPM" button for when it annoys me!

My real problem is that i have been driving Manual, Diesel cars for over 40 years, where the engines rarely exceed 2000 RPM

 

[littlescrote]

If you want to restrict the engine rpm, you'll restrict the efficiency. A petrol engine's efficiency is negatively affected by throttling the air intake which is how the load and speed are controlled. The control of the engine in the PHEV is cleverly done so that it essentially 'pulses' the engine on with a high load and open throttle to be most efficient and build u battery charge, or off completely and using battery charge. In between would be worst efficiency, so it doesn't do it.

Does that help with your "full understanding" of series mode?

 

[kpetrov]

As jaapv says, try it. Regardless of what you may read, the car does switch back to Series.

Since there is no gearbox the effect you describe may be occurring because of the gradient of acceleration you are demanding and the vehicle is decoupling the engine for that reason.
I will try what you have said in the next days when will have a chance to go on the highway.

Otherwise what littlescrote have said is true. I tend to never use the ICE in series mode but when it happens the RPMs are not linked to the vehicle speed. Since there is no point of idling in hybrid vehicles (except warming up) it's trying to get the most of the engine if it has to fire it.

 

[kpetrov]

As jaapv says, try it. Regardless of what you may read, the car does switch back to Series.

I have try it... to floor it while in parallel mode and had few results.
First result was it stayed in parallel but switched to parallel hybrid mode - rear motor kicked in with battery power.
Second was it went to series mode.
Third it went to battery power only.

Probably it depend on the gradient - how suddenly is done, but couldn't replicate it all the time.
On constant high power demand 15% slope it stays in parallel hybrid mode though.

 

[Trex]

As jaapv says, try it. Regardless of what you may read, the car does switch back to Series.

I have try it... to floor it while in parallel mode and had few results.
First result was it stayed in parallel but switched to parallel hybrid mode - rear motor kicked in with battery power.
Second was it went to series mode.
Third it went to battery power only.

Probably it depend on the gradient - how suddenly is done, but couldn't replicate it all the time.
On constant high power demand 15% slope it stays in parallel hybrid mode though.

Hi ,

It seems we have some confusion about this topic of series mode.

Now on both my Phevs (2014 and 2019) under about 120 kph there is more power available in series mode than parallel so it will drop out of parallel to series if power request is high enough.

This can be seen here in this video :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbOmtzFj14M

Watch the centre display and see how it goes into parallel mode at about 120 kph when using high power demand (low power demand on my Phevs it engages parallel mode at approx 70 kph) and after approx 120 kph there is now more power available from parallel mode so it switches to it.

Regards Trex.

 

[Trex]

Thank you everyone for your responses (I have been off-line for a week), however this thread is now drifting OFF-Topic.
I've now had the car for 3 months and covered 3000 miles. I fully understand the Series/Parallel Hybrid modes and the requirements behind them and Mitsubishi have made a pretty good attempt of powering a heavy petrol engined car with only a single gear ratio!

I was really hoping that someone (preferrably a PHEV Watchdog user) could confirm that in Series mode, their car also revs the engine, sometimes up to 4000RPM, when gently travelling up a steepish hill between 30 and 40 MPH. Mine does it, it is an awful racket and spoils an otherwise excellent car!

Hi,

When travelling around town here at our speed limit of 60 kph ( approx 35mph) I can keep my Phevs in EV mode and not hear the petrol motor at all even up what I think are quite steep hills. Maybe you haven't quite dialled your foot yet to do that?

If it revs to 4000rpm I would not call that "gently travelling" unless it's a bloody "steepish" hill and that kind of power is needed to get up it at only 30 to 40 mph? That's only 500 rpm off max power (for series mode at that speed) on my Phevs. :shock: Damn, must be real bad "steepish" hill for me or your not being so gentle. :?

Regards Trex.

 

[PhevGeorge]

Thanks for your comment Trex and I see you do understand my question.

Yes we do have steep hills here in rural Devon, England. The ones that give me issue have a gradient of around 10 - 14%. I test with heating turned off, Economy mode selected and I press the accelerator with a feather. If I keep to 30 MPH, then it usually stays in EV mode, but between 35 -40 MPH, the engine will eventually start to give the battery that little bit of help, and I fully understand that, but when the revs get to 4000 it is an awful racket and my best option (if it is safe and legal to do so) is to increase the speed to over 40MPH, when it will switch to Parallel mode and all becomes quiet!

I currently do all my trips with PHEV Watchdog connected and log the data, so I am quoting the actual RPM.

Greendwarf has said that this is to be expected and no one else has reported otherwise, so I had accepted that it was the nature of the beast, rather than a fault with my vehicle - unless you can show me otherwise ??

 

[Trex]

Thanks for your comment Trex and I see you do understand my question.

Hi PhevGeorge,
Your welcome and yes I think I do understand.

Yes we do have steep hills here in rural Devon, England. The ones that give me issue have a gradient of around 10 - 14%. I test with heating turned off, Economy mode selected and I press the accelerator with a feather. If I keep to 30 MPH, then it usually stays in EV mode, but between 35 -40 MPH, the engine will eventually start to give the battery that little bit of help, and I fully understand that, but when the revs get to 4000 it is an awful racket and my best option (if it is safe and legal to do so) is to increase the speed to over 40MPH, when it will switch to Parallel mode and all becomes quiet

Ok, we now have some more information, thanks.

If according to you 30mph can "usually stays in EV mode" why not climb them at 30mph? Will it really annoy other drivers that much to be a little slower in your 35mph zone (I assume) ? 4000 rpm sounds totally unnecessary I think when you nearly have enough power in EV mode it seems. :?

I have owned 4 hybrids now and as a engineer I love the technology . But I have learnt that to get the best from hybrids you need be "smoother" and probably "easier" with your driving technique to get the best out of them I think.

BTW after driving or travelling in different diesels ( Toyota, Merc, Mitsi, BMW, VW, Mazda, Ford and Holden ) I don't consider the the Phev any noisier than them when accelerating in their 3000 +rpm rev range. Good luck merging safely at only 2000rpm in a diesel on a busy freeway on ramp over here which is also the only time I usually hear the petrol motor in the Phev .

Regards Trex.

 

[littlescrote]

Use your power dial to control the kick in of the engine or not. As it transitions from green to white there is a point at which the ICE will come on depending on load, battery level rate of change of accelerator pedal etc.

You can get to the end of the all green bit and the engine will not kick in (unless you prod the accelerator to get there or have no battery left. Even a little bit of the Gren/White transition. But stray too far into the transition for long enough up a steep hill and the ICE will kick in. But it's hardly the end of the world. It sounds harsh as you're used to near silence at low speed, but it makes sense to run the engine hard to make it efficient as I've already explained.

 

[jaapv]

Thank you so much Greendwarf

That is exactly the simple answer I was looking for and means that there is no point in me entering into a dialogue with the Mitsubishi dealer that I purchased the car from last November - No one wants un-necessary trips to a Dealer!

I just need to dream about an "Engine Kill" or "Engine restrict to " 2K RPM" button for when it annoys me!

My real problem is that i have been driving Manual, Diesel cars for over 40 years, where the engines rarely exceed 2000 RPM

Basically that button is your right foot. Feathering the throttle really works in that situation. The EV button is quite effective too.