Save mode disabled when low on fuel

[spellinn]

On the way home from a 50 mile trip at the weekend I wanted to see how much range I still had when the "Refuel" message appears on the dash. With a flat battery, so running mostly on petrol, I had then done around 30 miles (so had reached the original predicted range before the REFUEL message blanks out the range estimation to --:--

At this point my wife was nervous that we'd run out of fuel on the motorway, and not having a jerry can, we decided to rapid charge at a nearby services. My plan was to use the 80% battery as "reserve" and use "Save" mode to continue to force petrol use until I ran out.

However, only when I rejoined the motorway did I realise that Save mode is disabled when you're low on fuel, which kind of scuppered my experiment as the next 20 or so miles were EV and didn't use any petrol at all!

This is probably in the manual somewhere, but just a warning to others.

Is there any way to "force" save mode?

Cheers

Neil

 

[gwatpe]

I found this out last year and it is somewhere on the forum. I tested the completely empty fuel tank experiment and my PHEV managed to drive about 160km from the --:-- appearing on the total range. Had a jerry can so was only worried about the Turtle mode appearing. SAVE mode became disabled in my testing as well.

When on a longer drive, I always tried to use SAVE mode, and I finally made a mod to allow my PHEV to either power ON in SAVE, or CHARGE or NORMAL mode. There are the critics and EV purists with opinions that differ from mine re the benefits this may have.

If you have a corded recharging source available at the end of any journey, then using the battery before the last of the fuel can be accessed should not pose too much a problem. Just need to reset a trip meter at the right time to work out how far you have gone. I find it easier now to just carry 10L of fuel and refuel if needed and not just fully drain the battery to access the last fuel in the tank. I don't always have a corded recharge available at the end of a drive.

Have not found any way to defeat this mode of operation and can't see a benefit to do so.

 

[maby]

I found this out last year and it is somewhere on the forum. I tested the completely empty fuel tank experiment and my PHEV managed to drive about 160km from the --:-- appearing on the total range. Had a jerry can so was only worried about the Turtle mode appearing. SAVE mode became disabled in my testing as well.

When on a longer drive, I always tried to use SAVE mode, and I finally made a mod to allow my PHEV to either power ON in SAVE, or CHARGE or NORMAL mode. There are the critics and EV purists with opinions that differ from mine re the benefits this may have.

If you have a corded recharging source available at the end of any journey, then using the battery before the last of the fuel can be accessed should not pose too much a problem. Just need to reset a trip meter at the right time to work out how far you have gone. I find it easier now to just carry 10L of fuel and refuel if needed and not just fully drain the battery to access the last fuel in the tank. I don't always have a corded recharge available at the end of a drive.

Have not found any way to defeat this mode of operation and can't see a benefit to do so.

Quite agree - if you did manage to fully drain the tank, it just means that you have to put more in on the next fill, so why try to force the issue?

 

[anko]

Interestingly enough, it will not use fuel to propel the car, but it will use fuel to heat the car :roll:

 

[mocara]

Hi,
I experienced this the other week. Ran out of fuel a few miles before the end of the motorway on the way to Portsmouth. Save dropped out automatically and I did the rest of the journey on battery. Luckily, I just made a fuel station with 3 miles to spare :!:

 

[anko]

Don't think you ran out of fuel. You just hit the reserve. Ho much were you able to add?

 

[mocara]

Don't think you ran out of fuel. You just hit the reserve. Ho much were you able to add?

Hi,
I was definitely out of reserve as well because the engine wasn't running at all, looking at the driver information display.

 

[anko]

That doesn't mean anything.

When you run in save or charge mode, with 5 liters of petrol left, the engine dies out and you are forced to empty the battery first (I think the engine may be started again when you really push it. Turning up the heat in absence of an electric heater or with to much of a temp difference may start it, that's for sure). Then when the battery is near lowest of the lowest, the engine starts again, and you can burn the last 5 liters of fuel. When all the fuel is gone, then you can use up the very last bit of SOC and then it is all over.

From what you wrote, it doesn't sound like you've reached that point.

 

[mocara]

That doesn't mean anything.

When you run in save or charge mode, with 5 liters of petrol left, the engine dies out and you are forced to empty the battery first (I think the engine may be started again when you really push it. Turning up the heat in absence of an electric heater or with to much of a temp difference may start it, that's for sure). Then when the battery is near lowest of the lowest, the engine starts again, and you can burn the last 5 liters of fuel. When all the fuel is gone, then you can use up the very last bit of SOC and then it is all over.

From what you wrote, it doesn't sound like you've reached that point.

Oh, right. So, I suffered my own little "range anxiety" period for nothing!! I was just reacting to no blue thermometer bar for fuel and only dashes for range left. I'm not sure I'm going to let it get down that far again, but thanks for all your help and reassurance.

 

[spellinn]

I found this out last year and it is somewhere on the forum. I tested the completely empty fuel tank experiment and my PHEV managed to drive about 160km from the --:-- appearing on the total range.

160km is quite impressive.

From refuelling shortly after --:-- range is displayed I found that I have approx 5L of petrol remaining.

The overly cautious refuelling warnings certainly mean people are making far more fuel stops that really necessary on long journeys. One should be maximising this period when the car is most efficient with lower fuel levels (less dead weight)

Cheers

Neil

 

[anko]

You are the first person to (effectively) request a smaller fuel tank :lol:

 

[spellinn]

You are the first person to (effectively) request a smaller fuel tank :lol:

Hehe..I'm happy with the size of the tank without Mitsubishi making it "virtually smaller" by the overly cautious REFUEL messages.

But it would be nice if I could choose to run with <5L of fuel in for most of my journeys (which are on EV) and actually know how much I had left.

Removing 40kg of dead weight would help with my EV range

Cheers

Neil

 

[PhevWestNorway]

That is aprox 2% of the 'car with driver' weight.
Weight is one parameter, wind resistance another (which is unchanged by weight).
So maybe 1% difference in energy loss with full tank?

 

[spellinn]

That is aprox 2% of the 'car with driver' weight.
Weight is one parameter, wind resistance another (which is unchanged by weight).
So maybe 1% difference in energy loss with full tank?

You're assuming I haven't ripped out the unused seats?

Most of my journeys are low speed around town, so I doubt wind resistance comes into play much.

Yes the 40kg is probably insignificant compared to the weight of the batteries etc, but having not found any major problems with the car there has to be something I can gripe about right? :lol:

Cheers

Neil

 

[msmatt]

This post is to thank all the early adopters of the PHEV for experimenting and posting lots of useful information, in the case of this topic, a number of years ago.

Last week I was driving on the highway in Save Mode, and according to the GOM, had enough total range to get home. Then, the predicted range started dropping faster, and the last number I saw for gasoline range before it changed to "--" was 45km. This was still okay to get home. However, about 5km later, with the Refuel light flashing fast, I realized it was running solely on battery which only had about 7km range remaining . Thinking something strange was going on, I pressed Save again - no response. Then tried Charge, but still the ICE would not start. At this point I was envisioning having to pull over and go hiking for fuel, not a pleasant or safe proposition on the highways near Toronto. Thankfully, the battery just got me to a service station, but then the car only took 36 litres to fill (?!).

I searched the forum which led me to this and other topics where other people had a many similar experiences. It is great to find out that the ICE will start again once the battery is fully depleted, something I did not assume would happen. The possible distance to true zero fuel is also a surprise. From the previous reports, it must run until the fuel pressure drops out, which, assuming a 43 litre total capacity, would have been about 7 litres or apprx 80-110km later.

All you can say is the PHEV is not a boring car. Thanks to all the previous posters.