Red warning triangle and loss of electric power

[Trigania]

Hi, can anyone help?
I was driving yesterday on electric power and the red warning triangle came on and the vehicle was really sluggish.
I managed to pull over as I was over tram tracks at the time and then I lost all power, the charging warning light came on and I was stranded.
They had to come and recover my vehicle as no one is trained to work on the electric system by the roadside.
Once back to the garage they said there is nothing wrong with it!
Now I do not feel safe - what would have happened if I was on the motorway?

Has anyone else had this problem as the garage obviously think it is down to user error?

At the time I had half a tank of fuel and 22 miles of battery.

Thank you

:x :?:

 

[gwatpe]

When I had problems with my PHEV, I had to return to the dealer with the fault still active. It was not until the dealer drove my PHEV after clearing the fault with a power cycle and the fault re appeared was any further action taken. MMC is very cautious re the electrics and control systems faults appearing. We are literally driving a ticking time bomb. When all is working well the PHEV is great and luckily it seems that the problem vehicles are few. My present PHEV still comes up with CAN-BUS warnings, and these just get cleared at a service. Dealer does not seem too concerned with warnings. I still suspect that the systems are flaky and will throw up warnings for the life of the car or until the computers or firmware are upgraded or replaced with a newer generation.

BTW user error is a generic excuse. The driver should not be able to cause an EV, or ABS etc fault when driving.

 

[greendwarf]

Well not actually "literally a time bomb"

 

[Trigania]

I had done a 10 minute journey which was fine with no problems at all then stopped for 2 minutes and then continued on my journey. After 2 minutes I noticed a grinding type noise and I felt the steering was very unresponsive. I pulled over and switched off. Turned back on and then I couldn't move the vehicle at all. Everything seemed to be on. There were 2 signs in the dash. First was a blue box with a outline of car with 3 battery's and the a orange triangle with an exclamation in it. RAC came and towed it to garage and after a couple of hours called me to say there didn't seem to be anything wrong and that they think it was the engine warming up!!!!!!! Um I don't think so. It's summer ( ish) here in the UK and it was a lovely day and mid morning. Then said it was because I had not got enough fuel? I had at the very least a 1/4 tank of fuel and a full charge. He used the words obviously nearly every other word so " obviously" was trying to say that I didn't know what I was talking about as I'm a woman! Seriously don't try that on with me!!!! I have said I am not happy to drive the car until they give me a better answer than plucking stuff out of the air! I have only had this from brand new since March and am not confident at all to go onto the motorway in case it happens again. Any tips would be very gratefully excepted.

 

[CJ1045]

If the car has any faults they will still be in the electronic control unit (ECU) as codes which the dealer should be able to diagnose. All cars these days have this and use a common port normally accessible from the footwell. I bought a little gizmo that you can plug into this then it talks by Bluetooth to an app on my android phone. We recently has a problem with our Peugeot that was coming on with an intermittent warning. I plugged in the gizmo and the app on my phone told me the fault code. I then Googled this and it said it was a fault with either the turbo or one of the sensors round the turbo. It turned out when the garage looked at it to be a faulty solenoid valve next to the turbo. Replaced and the car now as a new lease of life - suspect that the valve fault was always there but just got worse and worse as now the car seems to have more get up and go then it ever had.

So for you there are two things - faults generate fault codes that the car remembers and can then be read by the garage plugging in a reader so they should know exactly the issue. Secondly it is entirely possible for you to check the fault codes on the ECU yourself for very little money.

e.g.
ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=car+ecu+reader&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xandroid+diagnostic+code+reader.TRS0&_nkw=android+diagnostic+code+reader&_sacat=0

CJ

 

[jaapv]

And if the dealer cannot find it in the logs they will hook up the car to the factory in Japan who will debug the software. It happened to me.

 

[gwatpe]

My dealer in AUS did not have the necessary tools when I purchased my PHEV, but has since upgrades to all MUT-3 equipment. All fault and warning messages are recorded in the PHEV systems, so will definitely be there. I have not seen the dash message you described.

Conking out on a motorway would not be a good outcome. MMC took many months to sort my PHEV problems, with an eventual replacement the cheaper option. I photographed all screens and prepared a detailed lengthy document and involved the consumer rights department and it was eventually resolved.

Good luck, but it will require persistence and documentation to be resolved.

 

[greendwarf]

Question for OP - you describe being towed by RAC to garage. Was this arranged by Mitsu's Recovery Service (free with car in UK) to a Mitsu dealer or your own breakdown service to their local agent because it sounds as though neither the RAC or the garage staff understood the car - especially as the handbook warns against "towing" :?

 

[Trigania]

It was taken to Mitsubishi local garage.
I have car back now no conclusion and to return if it occurs again!!!

 

[jaapv]

It should have been a main dealer, I guess.

 

[PeteInOz]

Hi, can anyone help?
I was driving yesterday on electric power and the red warning triangle came on and the vehicle was really sluggish.
I managed to pull over as I was over tram tracks at the time and then I lost all power, the charging warning light came on and I was stranded.
They had to come and recover my vehicle as no one is trained to work on the electric system by the roadside.
Once back to the garage they said there is nothing wrong with it!
Now I do not feel safe - what would have happened if I was on the motorway?

Has anyone else had this problem as the garage obviously think it is down to user error?

At the time I had half a tank of fuel and 22 miles of battery.

Thank you

:x :?:

Hmmm ... this fault indication is very interesting indeed.

I suspect, though I could be very wrong here, that if the 'tram track' infrastructure was electrified then it may have interfered with your onboard electronics - thinking that a charge cable may have been inserted (i.e. there may have been enough electrical power from the overhead electrical cables to have induced a signal onto the comms port and charging line of your vehicle - thereby disabling your car as the onboard electronics would have thought you had plugged in). Whilst my explanation here seems highly implausible as the vehicle should be well shielded from such events, it nevertheless may explain a unique circumstance upon which the fault occurred and it might further explain why the maintenance facility was unable to replicate the fault and offer you a reasonable explanation.

I am sure I speak for many others here in asking for a more detailed description of the circumstances upon which the fault occurred. As an example, is the tram network that you referred to in your original post electrified? If so, was your PHEV in the immediate vicinity of an active tram (i.e. were you ahead, behind or passing a tram when you started to notice the car lose power). If so, then this may doubly help to prove out my point here.

I hope this helps ....

Cheers PeteInOz

 

[gwatpe]

Is it possible that your PHEV has one of those static straps on the body that may have touched the track.

Even warnings are recorded in the computer, so MMC should be able to fault find from an error code.

 

[jaapv]

That appears to be a rather unlikely scenario. Wet tyres are as conductive as such a strap. That would mean it would be impossible to cross tram tracks in the rain.

 

[PeteInOz]

G'day Trigania and all,

Given the serious nature of the fault that has been reported by Trigania here and her understandable apprehension about the vehicle's safety, I approached my local Service Manager here today and provided him with a link to this thread and expressed some concern that the circumstances surrounding this fault condition might very well appear elsewhere where trams are located )e.g. Melbourne Australia). Upon review, the Service Manager in-turn submitted this out on the Mitsubishi Australia (MMAL) service wire and a senior technical officer from MMAL called him back directly. I was advised that this MMAL Tech Officer had spent some time in the UK and from memory he believed that the trams over there are actually power from underneath the ground and not from overhead wire infrastructure as I had originally assumed. Irrespective of this, if my thinking is correct here, and if there is a shielding or interference problem with a vehicle in close proximity to high voltage power, then this might be exacerbated further as the vehicle would be even closer to the point source of any potential EMF.

MMAL is not aware of any similar circumstances here in Australia (well none that have been specifically reported that is), but nevertheless, they have clearly shown that they do take such incidents very seriously, and as such, they have strongly recommended that Trigania should go back to the Service/Repair facility that she attended and have the Service Manager there specifically raise a "DQR" on the incident, irrespective of whether a fault was found or not, so that it can be formally recorded and submitted straight back to MMC in Japan.

Unfortunately, MMAL are unable to submit the DQR on Trigania's behalf as the vehicle resides in a different region and in all probably is of a different build spec to that of Australian vehicles. Also, as part of the DQR process, the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) is recorded, which in turn will help Mitsubishi establish the specific build spec of the vehicle concerned so as to help eliminate any known faults that might exist in any specific subsystem within the vehicle. A copy of the DQR should be provided to Trigania as a matter of courtesy and due process.

Without wanting to appear alarmist here, given the potentially serious nature of this fault, it would be prudent if Trigania could register this fault post haste ... if she was so willing.

I hope this helps ...

Cheers PeteInOz

PS For forum moderators: Not sure if Trigania is actively following this thread now or not. If at all possible, could you please contact Trigania directly and make her aware of the information contained within please? PT

 

[Neverfuel]

Power for UK trams is delivered by overhead wires that are a minimum of 16 feet 6 inches from the ground to allow HGV's to pass beneath. I think we should forget this scenario, I cross the East Coast Main Line every day - this line is electrofied, I also travel across tram lines in Sheffield. Never a problem - more likely to have been a software glitch.

 

[PeteInOz]

Power for UK trams is delivered by overhead wires that are a minimum of 16 feet 6 inches from the ground to allow HGV's to pass beneath. I think we should forget this scenario, I cross the East Coast Main Line every day - this line is electrofied, I also travel across tram lines in Sheffield. Never a problem - more likely to have been a software glitch.

G'day Neverfuel,

Thanks for the confirmation of the UK tram system and your own experiences .... they are greatly appreciated! You may well be very right that it may have been a spurious software glitch that may have caused the failure, but given the nature of the fault experienced by Trigania, then I tend to think that the advice given by MMAL (i.e. to have a DQR raised) would still be a prudent step, so as to at least give Trigania confidence that every possible step will be taken by MMUK / MMC to eliminate any known possible faults with her specific build spec, and if necessary, to try and investigate further any circumstances surrounding the specific failure she suffered. I realise that the latter could be almost impossible given the multitude of variables but that's my advice at least anyway.

Anyway, thanks again mate for the input.

Cheers PeterInOz

 

[outofyorkshire]

Power for UK trams is delivered by overhead wires that are a minimum of 16 feet 6 inches from the ground to allow HGV's to pass beneath. I think we should forget this scenario, I cross the East Coast Main Line every day - this line is electrofied, I also travel across tram lines in Sheffield. Never a problem - more likely to have been a software glitch.

I cross East Coast Line here @ Newark twice a day too... can be sat at the barrier for 10 mins waiting for the bleeding things to pass :lol:
Never had any sort of problem and have sat there in all combinations of park / neutral / powered down :lol:

 

[Grigou]

I cross tram lines (powered by the tracks) often here in Lyon. No problem.
I cross my fingers, too :lol: