Petrol engine starting

[ultralights]

I have been trying to find out just how the petrol engine is started. I have driven a lot of Euro cars, that stop the engine when the vehicle has stopped, then restart the engine when the accelerator is pressed, and there is a noticeable lag between the engine turning over on the starter motor, the engine actually starting then moving off.

This i have not felt or head in my PHEV, the engine starts instantly with no obvious cranking of a starter motor, i am assuming, that the front drive motor acts as a starter motor, and starts the petrol engine via the clutch, so there is no noticeable change in power, or starter cranking before start, but even when parked, then starting the engine to charge, there is still a lack of a starter motor cranking for a few noticeable moments before the engine actually fires up.

so, is there another starter motor to start the engine only, or is there a starter motor, and clutch used to start the engine when in motion when the front motor is providing drive as well?

 

[Kim]

You're close.
But it's the generator that does the starting.
The drive motor is always connected to the wheels, so it could not be used to start the ICE in a stationary situation.

 

[ultralights]

ah ok, makes sense, i was thinking it would a waste if they had another starter motor just for petrol engine starting.

Thanks

 

[anko]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .

 

[SolarBoy]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .

I am unsure if you are joking or not, I can feel the transition from serial/hybrid? It's noticeable though not horrid.

 

[jaapv]

It is venerable technology. Dating back to the twenties, it was fitted to some cars and motorcycles up to the advent of the alternator. Way back in the last century I owned an NSU Prinz 4 with a Dynastart.

 

[jaapv]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .

I am unsure if you are joking or not, I can feel the transition from serial/hybrid? It's noticeable though not horrid.

I'm not quite sure what the transition from serial to parallel hybrid has to do with it. This is about the starting of the ICE so surely the transition from EV to (any kind of) hybrid is meant?

 

[Ollycat]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .

I am unsure if you are joking or not, I can feel the transition from serial/hybrid? It's noticeable though not horrid.

Definitely - usually accompianied by a scream from the automatic transmission as I apply the pedal to the carpet!! And any unwary pedestrians that I've been sneaking up on....

More interested in why it cuts in when battery is full, air con is off, and I'm sat at traffic lights....

 

[jaapv]

Automatic transmission????

 

[SolarBoy]

Automatic transmission????

:lol:

I just say yes when asked is it an automatic ...

 

[anko]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .

I am unsure if you are joking or not, I can feel the transition from serial/hybrid? It's noticeable though not horrid.

I'm not quite sure what the transition from serial to parallel hybrid has to do with it. This is about the starting of the ICE so surely the transition from EV to (any kind of) hybrid is meant?

No, I meant transition from serial to parallel hybrid mode.

Lets not forget, you cannot transition from EV mode to parallel hybrid mode. The engine first has to be started and brought up to speed (serial mode) before it can be connected to the wheels (parallel mode). You cannot skip serial mode.

The PHEV does not have a normal friction clutch or torque converter for syncing engine speed to car speed. Not having these, one would expect rather 'violent' transitions. But in the PHEV, the powerful generator is used to precisely control the engine speed to match the speed of the car before the engine is connected to the wheels. And this allows for smooth transitions.

 

[anko]

Automatic transmission????

:lol:

I just say yes when asked is it an automatic ...

And why not? The transmission engages and disengages automatically. As a matter of fact, you have no direct control over it. Only circumstantial.

 

[anko]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .

I am unsure if you are joking or not, I can feel the transition from serial/hybrid? It's noticeable though not horrid.

No, I am not joking. When driving 100 km/h on the motorway, I am usually not aware of the transitions, even though they take place every 2 minutes or so. Only when I pay special attention to it, I may become aware of it. To me it is more than smooth enough.

 

[Tipper]

I've never felt any transition between modes but I can certainly hear it! :lol:

 

[jaapv]

Also, our 'starter motor' is huge and thus very capable when it comes to controlling engine speed, allowing for the smooth (virtually clutch free) transition from serial to hybrid drive mode we all love so much .[

I am unsure if you are joking or not, I can feel the transition from serial/hybrid? It's noticeable though not horrid.

I'm not quite sure what the transition from serial to parallel hybrid has to do with it. This is about the starting of the ICE so surely the transition from EV to (any kind of) hybrid is meant?

No, I meant transition from serial to parallel hybrid mode.

Lets not forget, you cannot transition from EV mode to parallel hybrid mode. The engine first has to be started and brought up to speed (serial mode) before it can be connected to the wheels (parallel mode). You cannot skip serial mode.

The PHEV does not have a normal friction clutch or torque converter for syncing engine speed to car speed. Not having these, one would expect rather 'violent' transitions. But in the PHEV, the powerful generator is used to precisely control the engine speed to match the speed of the car before the engine is connected to the wheels. And this allows for smooth transitions.

Yes, that is all well established, but the OP asked about the starting of the ICE, whether it had a starter motor, even when stationary.

 

[anko]

I was just elaborating on some of the (additional) advantages of using the generator for starting the engine. And some of these are related to the transition from serial to parallel hybrid mode.