Newbie

[stuartJ]

Hi
Im a real newbie have been give a outlander as company car which is great but and its a big but....... I'm clueless first week I've not got over 37mpg I do about 50-60 mile to and from work and can't charge when not at home. Is there a idiots guide please. At present I'm flying with eco mode on and battery is flat in about 15miles Help please Thanks in advance.

:?: :?:

 

[jaapv]

Welcome, and what can I say, I don't know where to start. The best thing you can do is spend a few hours browsing the forum.

 

[SolarBoy]

Welcome, I know it's painful but read the manual... Though after 9 months I am still learning!

 

[Steel188]

I'm sorry today, that sounds about right. I've had my company car since the end of February and am now at 24,000 miles and the only place I can charge at the moment is at the office (when I'm there) with lots of motorway driving when I'm out.

Battery range is massively effected by ambient temperature, so the cold and damp mornings this week haven't helped you at all, but once the battery has gone you're driving an 1800Kg petrol powered brick. All be it a very comfortable, quiet brick with an excellent view over the bonnet!

As has already been said, do invest the time to read the manual which will help you to understand the car. In time you will learn to relax into the driving technique, you right foot will become less leaden, and you might see the mpg hit 40! However, when you go out on 'near home duties' at the week end, you may be able to do the whole lot on electric power and never start the petrol engine beyond the initial start up process, which will help your overall mpg.

In my case, my mpg isn't helped by the fact that I take the view that one doesn't drive a £35,000 car to not have the heating and electric seats on, run the a/c or enjoy the performance (in moderation and only where legal!), but maybe that's just me.

Above all, enjoy it.

 

[SolarBoy]

In my case, my mpg isn't helped by the fact that I take the view that one doesn't drive a £35,000 car to not have the heating and electric seats on, run the a/c or enjoy the performance (in moderation and only where legal!), but maybe that's just me.

Above all, enjoy it.

Agreed Steel188, though if you could have a word with my Mrs about turning off the heated seats when she's finished that'd be great coz I get 5 miles down the road and then have a well roasted backside!

 

[stuartJ]

Guessing it's probably not the best car for me but with the tax benefits it could work out ok.my own golf has been doing me proud at 65 mpg and I was getting 28p a mile from company now with there car I'm only getting 12p which doesn't cover cost of fuel

 

[Tipper]

Welcome.
I would suggest:
1. Only read the mpg by selecting 'manual' on the computer screen, it's on one of the trip screens. Sadly it defaults to auto on every start which only gives mpg on the last journey which I find useless and annoying as I prefer overall mpg over time, currently around 70 mpg on mine with very mixed journeys both local electric only and motorway jaunts.
2. Turn off the aircon except when you need it. You can deselect auto running of the aircon..another annoyance!
3. Make sure the heated seats are off...they don't switch off automatically when you switch off the car.
Other than that we 'JFDI'. Enjoy!

 

[stuartJ]

Some great advice
Another week ahead I will ware my log johns and put some gloves on my xmas list.

Thanks guys



First forum I've ever signed up too !!

 

[jaapv]

Welcome.
I would suggest:
1. Only read the mpg by selecting 'manual' on the computer screen, it's on one of the trip screens. Sadly it defaults to auto on every start which only gives mpg on the last journey which I find useless and annoying as I prefer overall mpg over time, currently around 70 mpg on mine with very mixed journeys both local electric only and motorway jaunts.
2. Turn off the aircon except when you need it. You can deselect auto running of the aircon..another annoyance!
3. Make sure the heated seats are off...they don't switch off automatically when you switch off the car.
Other than that we 'JFDI'. Enjoy!

To add - you deselect the auto-aircon by press-and-hold the airconditioning button for ten seconds.
The heated seats use only limited power BTW, I doubt whether there is a measurable effect on economy by not using them. Using windscreen, mirror and rear window defrost is much worse.

 

[ultralights]

If your driving out of battery range, and starting with a full battery, trick is to leave it in SAVE mode, this will force it to drive like a conventional hybrid, saving fuel, it will start the journey on Battery only, but when there is room to add charge back to the battery, the engine will drive the car and recharge the battery, once full again, it will go back to EV only for a bit, then repeat, also, in this mode, when you need acceleration, or climbing a hill, it will draw on the battery as well as the motor to save fuel, then it will recharge as you drive...

 

[geoffshep69]

If your driving out of battery range, and starting with a full battery, trick is to leave it in SAVE mode, this will force it to drive like a conventional hybrid, saving fuel, it will start the journey on Battery only, but when there is room to add charge back to the battery, the engine will drive the car and recharge the battery, once full again, it will go back to EV only for a bit, then repeat, also, in this mode, when you need acceleration, or climbing a hill, it will draw on the battery as well as the motor to save fuel, then it will recharge as you drive...

I dont think its as simple as that. If you are starting with a full battery and driving out of battery range, then (assuming you want to end up with a flat battery at your destination) you will ultimately be using up all your battery and some petrol. All that 'save' does is help to decide where you use battery and where you use petrol. Unless there is a big difference in your journey (e.g. part motorway, part city) then pressing save will make little or no difference to your overall economy across the entire journey.

If the first 15 miles of your journey is across a city, and then you are going to be doing 40 miles on the motorway, I'd suggest that your advice of pressing save at the start is the wrong thing to do. Doing that will result in you using petrol in the city, and all your battery on the motorway, which is the opposite of what you want for optimal efficiceny.

 

[jaapv]

Agree. The advice: press save on the motorway in general but make sure to run the battery down in local driving is the proper advice.

 

[jdsx]

And in fact at this time of year (except in Oz :lol: ), you are better running ICE at the start of your trip and using that waste heat to assist with cabin heating (as long as you're going outside EV range, of course).

 

[anko]

I'll say it once more: when it comes to burning fuel the efficiency of the ICE depends on the load you put on it. And the load you can put on the ICE depends for a good deal on the willingness of the battery to accept a decent charge current. Keeping the battery near full makes it less willing to accept a decent charge current. And thus reduces the load on the ICE and with it the efficiency of the ICE.

We have all noticed that regen braking is less effective when the battery is close to full. So, instead of regening you must use the friction brakes to loose speed, which is very inefficient. The same with the ICE. With the battery near full, the PHEV is not a hybrid car anymore, but a very heavy ICE car. Optimal efficiency is only reached when the battery is more than half empty on the gauge (or less than half full if you like)

That being said, in winter time another factor plays up. During a long trip in cold weather, with the heater on, the longer it takes for the ICE to come on, the more electricity will be used by the heater where engine warmth could have been used if the engine had been running.

On a positive note: running the heater puts additional load on the engine (as it consumes electricity) and makes it run more efficiently (for the time the heater and the ICE are both running).

Edit: Sorry, jsdx. Missed your post. Question was: what counts for more?

 

[ultralights]

in my situation, all my trips outside of battery range tend to be in the range of 400 to 500 Km trips, in that situation i have found starting the trip in save made tends to be the most efficient over the 500km trip, i try to plan my trip and save and charge button usage to try and arrive at my destination with 1/4 or less of battery. in other words, saving the battery for climbs up mountains and hilly terrain, using EV for those parts of the trips when in towns, which are no more than a few km at a time. over these type of trips i have found that starting in save mode results in the least fuel used over 500km.

 

[anko]

over these type of trips i have found that starting in save mode results in the least fuel used over 500km.

Compared to what other strategies? Have you tried letting the SOC run down and build it back up, just in advance of needing it? Like a few miles before entering one of these towns? Or maintaining for example 40% SOC (on the gauge) instead of as much as possible?

I agree, saving some battery charge for hill climbing probably could be advantageous when it allows you to climb a hill in parallel mode rather than serial mode, both from a comfort perspective as from an efficiency perspective. But how much charge do you need for this? Especially when you realise that some of it may be recovered on your descent at the other side of the hill ....

 

[ultralights]

over these type of trips i have found that starting in save mode results in the least fuel used over 500km.

Compared to what other strategies? Have you tried letting the SOC run down and build it back up, just in advance of needing it? Like a few miles before entering one of these towns? Or maintaining for example 40% SOC (on the gauge) instead of as much as possible?

I agree, saving some battery charge for hill climbing probably could be advantageous when it allows you to climb a hill in parallel mode rather than serial mode, both from a comfort perspective as from an efficiency perspective. But how much charge do you need for this? Especially when you realise that some of it may be recovered on your descent at the other side of the hill ....

todays trip was a 300km round trip, climbing from sea level to 1300 mtrs about 150km into the drive.. and return, fuel use was 6.2 L/100Km. leave home, set save mode, battery drops about 10% before engine fires up. up climb, battery dropped from 90% to about 40% in save mode, drive down regenerated to about 60%, which was left on save for run home then EV only for the last 20km to arrive with battery just about empty.

the same trip after letting it run to 0 on the dash, then setting charge mode before the climb, resulted in battery only getting back from 0 on the dash to about 1/4 then the battery draining to 0 while during the run up the mountain, resulting in LOTS of RPM climbing at speeds below 60kph, coming back down regained about 20%, then charge until i had enough battery to make it home on EV only, fuel used was about 8 L/100km.

 

[anko]

over these type of trips i have found that starting in save mode results in the least fuel used over 500km.

Compared to what other strategies? Have you tried letting the SOC run down and build it back up, just in advance of needing it? Like a few miles before entering one of these towns? Or maintaining for example 40% SOC (on the gauge) instead of as much as possible?

I agree, saving some battery charge for hill climbing probably could be advantageous when it allows you to climb a hill in parallel mode rather than serial mode, both from a comfort perspective as from an efficiency perspective. But how much charge do you need for this? Especially when you realise that some of it may be recovered on your descent at the other side of the hill ....

todays trip was a 300km round trip, climbing from sea level to 1300 mtrs about 150km into the drive.. and return, fuel use was 6.2 L/100Km. leave home, set save mode, battery drops about 10% before engine fires up. up climb, battery dropped from 90% to about 40% in save mode, drive down regenerated to about 60%, which was left on save for run home then EV only for the last 20km to arrive with battery just about empty.

the same trip after letting it run to 0 on the dash, then setting charge mode before the climb, resulted in battery only getting back from 0 on the dash to about 1/4 then the battery draining to 0 while during the run up the mountain, resulting in LOTS of RPM climbing at speeds below 60kph, coming back down regained about 20%, then charge until i had enough battery to make it home on EV only, fuel used was about 8 L/100km.

Not your typical drive, I would say Would it be worth trying to allow SOC drop to 60 or even 50% before hitting Save mode? And allow it to drop to 10 or 0% during the climb and growing back to 30 - 40% on the descent?

 

[zzcoopej]

the run up the mountain, resulting in LOTS of RPM climbing at speeds below 60kph

Blue Mountains?
1.8l/100km is about 30% more fuel. If you started both trips with 100% SOC (charged the night before) and returned with matching SOC's (real not dash) in each test then I'm struggling to see how such a large difference could only be due to save or charge? You said the mountain climb on Charge was <60km/h so this would be Series, maybe the drive on Save meant you could climb slightly faster and remain in Parallel which could explain the large efficiency difference?
Also, isn't there a 4 hour "timer" between trips where the trip computer data resets, was your time at the destination the same on both trips?

 

[ultralights]

the run up the mountain, resulting in LOTS of RPM climbing at speeds below 60kph

Blue Mountains?
1.8l/100km is about 30% more fuel. If you started both trips with 100% SOC (charged the night before) and returned with matching SOC's (real not dash) in each test then I'm struggling to see how such a large difference could only be due to save or charge? You said the mountain climb on Charge was <60km/h so this would be Series, maybe the drive on Save meant you could climb slightly faster and remain in Parallel which could explain the large efficiency difference?
Also, isn't there a 4 hour "timer" between trips where the trip computer data resets, was your time at the destination the same on both trips?

not the Blue Mountains, driving from South West Rocks to Ebor, via Dorrigo. ill be back in Sydney next week and back to 99% ev mode. time at destination is about 1 hour, so am taking fuel readings at end of trip after each day, and starting from full battery overnight.

variables i have not considered could be traffic, following a truck on 1 trip, meant average speed up the hill was about 30Kph. even without traffic,your flat out getting to 60, its a steep and narrow road. climbing from 200Mtrs to 1300 mtrs.