Converter plug?

[DavidWh]

Is it possible to get a simple converter from the Type 2 male to a 3 pin socket. I'm thinking this may be a much cheaper and easier way of using the type 2 public charging sockets without having to buy a whole new cable for £hundreds which, given the amount of use it will get is not really worth it.
Thanks for any info.

 

[anko]

Is it possible to get a simple converter from the Type 2 male to a 3 pin socket. I'm thinking this may be a much cheaper and easier way of using the type 2 public charging sockets without having to buy a whole new cable for £hundreds which, given the amount of use it will get is not really worth it.
Thanks for any info.

Possible? Yes.
Dangerous? Yes.
Legal? I guess not.

 

[DavidWh]

Is it possible to get a simple converter from the Type 2 male to a 3 pin socket. I'm thinking this may be a much cheaper and easier way of using the type 2 public charging sockets without having to buy a whole new cable for £hundreds which, given the amount of use it will get is not really worth it.
Thanks for any info.

Possible? Yes.
Dangerous? Yes.
Legal? I guess not.

Why dangerous anko? Do they not both draw the same current?

 

[anko]

The station advertises a max current via the pilot pin. The car communicates back that it is connected and (when applicable) that it wants to charge.

You have to build a connector that tells the charge station a car is connected and ready to charge. But it will do so, even when the car is not there. So, the main leads will always be hot. But that is not the biggest issue.

The standard mode 2 charge cable advertises 10 amps as max current to the car. When you hook it up to a charge station that supports only 6 amps (maybe only temporarily because of load balancing logic for example), the mode 2 charge will still advertise 10 amps to the car. The car may then actually draw 10 amps where the charge station only supports 6 amps.

Now, 10 amps is not to much and most charge stations will support it, but it is a clear violation of a protocol, which is mainly there for safety reasons.

 

[elm70]

Is it possible to get a simple converter from the Type 2 male to a 3 pin socket. I'm thinking this may be a much cheaper and easier way of using the type 2 public charging sockets without having to buy a whole new cable for £hundreds which, given the amount of use it will get is not really worth it.
Thanks for any info.

Who ever invented the complicated way to use 220ac on a car .... is somebody that cause a big waste of money

10amp charge at 220v ... is 2200w power .. equivalent to many home electric appliance that we plug to our home power socket every day without having to invent an expensive protocol for make some safe what is already safe

Different story if for the fast DC charger, which definitely need a protocol

But when the input is AC .. and the charger is in the car ... is a total waste ... a shame that some standardized body waste time for invent incompatible protocols and plugs ... for have expensive cables , expensive charging boxes ... and incompatible public plugs

 

[anko]

Who ever invented the complicated way to use 220ac on a car .... is somebody that cause a big waste of money

10amp charge at 220v ... is 2200w power .. equivalent to many home electric appliance ...

Sure. Unfortunately (or rather fortunately) the PHEV charger is not restricted to 10 amps :roll:

Other (PH)EV chargers go even further than the Oultander. Imagine somebody hooking up a TESLA or a 7.2 kW Leaf to a power outlet without any control unit ....

 

[Lance]

.. a shame that some standardized body waste time for invent incompatible protocols and plugs ... for have expensive cables , expensive charging boxes ... and incompatible public plugs

The Mitsubishi charging cable costs a lot more than the type 1 to type 2 cables needed for most public chargers in the U.K. - around double the price.

 

[jaapv]

Is it possible to get a simple converter from the Type 2 male to a 3 pin socket. I'm thinking this may be a much cheaper and easier way of using the type 2 public charging sockets without having to buy a whole new cable for £hundreds which, given the amount of use it will get is not really worth it.
Thanks for any info.

Who ever invented the complicated way to use 220ac on a car .... is somebody that cause a big waste of money

10amp charge at 220v ... is 2200w power .. equivalent to many home electric appliance that we plug to our home power socket every day without having to invent an expensive protocol for make some safe what is already safe

Different story if for the fast DC charger, which definitely need a protocol

But when the input is AC .. and the charger is in the car ... is a total waste ... a shame that some standardized body waste time for invent incompatible protocols and plugs ... for have expensive cables , expensive charging boxes ... and incompatible public plugs

Well,some of the main considerations are that the car will often be charged outside, in rain and snow and the danger of mechanical damage to cables.
There was some concern about not electrocuting the owner.
Which led to the use of safe plugs, heavy-duty cables and communicating equipment.

 

[elm70]

Who ever invented the complicated way to use 220ac on a car .... is somebody that cause a big waste of money

10amp charge at 220v ... is 2200w power .. equivalent to many home electric appliance ...

Sure. Unfortunately (or rather fortunately) the PHEV charger is not restricted to 10 amps :roll:

Other (PH)EV chargers go even further than the Oultander. Imagine somebody hooking up a TESLA or a 7.2 kW Leaf to a power outlet without any control unit ....

The Outlander can do max 16Amp .. that is 3.5kw .. 16Amp are nothing special (simple hobby RC 1/10 electric cars handle up to 100Amp peak and 30Amp average ... also .. what is dangerous for human is not the amps but the voltage) ... anyhow ... when used at home, we have the charging box in the middle with its "useless protocol" .. on one side the car plug (J1772) ... and surprise surprise .. on the other side we are back to normal 220v plug ... so tell me what did we win .. compared to plug straight 220v to the car ?

As I was saying ... fast charge, with DC handling is a different story

But it we use AC .. we are stuck to the limit of the home "power network" .. for instance my 8kw heater don't need any protocol for get the power from my home electric network

Well,some of the main considerations are that the car will often be charged outside, in rain and snow and the danger of mechanical damage to cables.
There was some concern about not electrocuting the owner.
Which led to the use of safe plugs, heavy-duty cables and communicating equipment.

There are tons of home electric equipment that are designed for outdoor usage, like electric lawnmower, electric chainsaw , etc which normally use a lot of power (over 2kw) .. but it is correct that normally people don't use these when it is snowing or raining (rain water, if there is not much pollution, it does not conduct electricity, pure water is a good electrical isolator)

But yes, I can see that without a protocol (specific plug is not really needed, since it is possible to have signals over the 220ac dual connection) ... 1 dummy user every 100.000 user may get electrified without any protocol handling that can prevent to power the car (for monitor power leak which may arm something or somebody near the car plug, it is definitely needed a proper signal handshaking and power monitoring (one two side, before and after the car plug)) .. but .. to kill the most dummy users is a good practice for bring back the Darwin evolution system

Personally I think that over-engineering did happen in this AC car charging ... possibly somebody decided it was a new way to suck money making over-engineering instead go for the most simple approach

 

[anko]

... so tell me what did we win .. compared to plug straight 220v to the car ?

In many homes, standard household sockets are rated for 10 amps max. So, somebody or something must tell the car not to draw more than 10 amps. This is what the 'useless protocol' does. Same 'useless protocol' allows me to charge with 6 amps on for example a campsite without blowing out the fuses. I would suggest, you try that without control box and find out for yourself ....

 

[Regulo]

And before it does almost anything else, it checks for earth continuity through the control box to the car.

 

[jaapv]

Who ever invented the complicated way to use 220ac on a car .... is somebody that cause a big waste of money

10amp charge at 220v ... is 2200w power .. equivalent to many home electric appliance ...

Sure. Unfortunately (or rather fortunately) the PHEV charger is not restricted to 10 amps :roll:

Other (PH)EV chargers go even further than the Oultander. Imagine somebody hooking up a TESLA or a 7.2 kW Leaf to a power outlet without any control unit ....

The Outlander can do max 16Amp .. that is 3.5kw .. 16Amp are nothing special (simple hobby RC 1/10 electric cars handle up to 100Amp peak and 30Amp average ... also .. what is dangerous for human is not the amps but the voltage) ... anyhow ... when used at home, we have the charging box in the middle with its "useless protocol" .. on one side the car plug (J1772) ... and surprise surprise .. on the other side we are back to normal 220v plug ... so tell me what did we win .. compared to plug straight 220v to the car ?

As I was saying ... fast charge, with DC handling is a different story

But it we use AC .. we are stuck to the limit of the home "power network" .. for instance my 8kw heater don't need any protocol for get the power from my home electric network

Well,some of the main considerations are that the car will often be charged outside, in rain and snow and the danger of mechanical damage to cables.
There was some concern about not electrocuting the owner.
Which led to the use of safe plugs, heavy-duty cables and communicating equipment.

There are tons of home electric equipment that are designed for outdoor usage, like electric lawnmower, electric chainsaw , etc which normally use a lot of power (over 2kw) .. but it is correct that normally people don't use these when it is snowing or raining (rain water, if there is not much pollution, it does not conduct electricity, pure water is a good electrical isolator)

But yes, I can see that without a protocol (specific plug is not really needed, since it is possible to have signals over the 220ac dual connection) ... 1 dummy user every 100.000 user may get electrified without any protocol handling that can prevent to power the car (for monitor power leak which may arm something or somebody near the car plug, it is definitely needed a proper signal handshaking and power monitoring (one two side, before and after the car plug)) .. but .. to kill the most dummy users is a good practice for bring back the Darwin evolution system

Personally I think that over-engineering did happen in this AC car charging ... possibly somebody decided it was a new way to suck money making over-engineering instead go for the most simple approach

Well, that would have to be somebody with control over all EV makers world-wide... :roll:
But it's a free world - by all means go ahead with your project, it might even earn you a nomination for a Darwin Award...

http://www.darwinawards.com/

 

[Mdejon]

since here in Brazil there only type2 bmw wallboxes, I use an adapter bought at http://evbitz.uk/EVBitz.uk/T2_T1_Cables_-_1P.html

Works fine and charge At 16amps.