Charging cable fault - Mitsubishi not honouring warranty

[jamiewakeham]

Morning all

I've a 66 plate PHEV, which is on a three year lease. I charge it daily on a regular IP66 13A socket I had installed on my driveway. The charge cable plug has always got quite hot when charging. There is a hook to hang it from, as per instructions.

I've just spotted that the plug has scorch marks on it - it looks for all the world like current has been arcing out of the plug socket and into the live pin.

Just heard from my local Mitsubishi dealer (not the dealer who supplied it - my lease company used one that's miles away) that Mitsubishi UK will not replace or repair the cable under warranty and my only option is to buy a new cable.

I'm not sure what my next step is here. Should I be taking this up with Mitsubishi UK as the warrantor, or the distant dealer as the supplier, or my lease company who I actually have a contract with? I am damned if I'm buying a new £800 cable for the sake of a dodgy plug!

Cheers
Jamie

 

[jaapv]

The first responsible is the company that supplied your car. If you don’t het a satiafactory respondenten, take it to the small claims Court. A charger should not cost 800 GBP. A third party one, like Ratio costs half and is better. And they are very good with guaranty.

 

[jamiewakeham]

Cheers, Jaap. I've just ipcked the car up; photo of the problem below.

It looks to me like the fault is the plug itself, and nothing 'further down' the chain. The dealer showed me a bulletin from Mitsubishi, explicitly stating that this problem (with a very similarly burned plug) was not to be treated as a warranty repair. Clearly this is not the first time they've seen this!

I think I've got a tricky decision to make now. I could call my lease company, tell them that there's a problem with the vehicle they supplied, and ask them to replace or repair the charger. I have a bad feeling that this leads to me being pushed from lease company to supplying dealer to Mitsubishi UK, with no-one wanting to take responsibility for it, and ends with me taking my lease company to the SCC.

Or I could just go get a black plug, cut the old one off, and replace it. I mean, it's just a plug, isn't it? But then I find myself wondering what happens in fifteen months when I hand the car back and they notice a non-official repair job.

 

[Andrev]

This is an exemple why I buy cars and not lease them. I am unable to be afraid of a dent, scratch, malfunction or cannot do modifications on a car during 3 or 4 years. The stress involved is greater than the money saved, especially when the interest rate is low.
If I were you, I will change the plug for a black high quality one, to be sure to skip a potential fire of your house or car.
I suggest to plug the charger first and the car after, it will reduce the possibility of an arc like yours.

 

[ChrisMiller]

This is an exemple why I buy cars and not lease them. I am unable to be afraid of a dent, scratch, malfunction or cannot do modifications on a car during 3 or 4 years. The stress involved is greater than the money saved, especially when the interest rate is low.

I agree in principle, but in the UK corporate vehicles are almost invariably leased and employees get no say in the matter. And for EVs the savings on a corporate lease can amount to thousands of pounds, because of tax benefits.

 

[nedh]

Chris, I had the exact same problem with a 2014 G4H, out of warranty so no fear. I measured the plug temperature at > 70ºC which is well over spec for PVC parts. I considered opening the main box to replace the mains side of the cable but abandoned that idea. The lady is not for turning and that box is not for opening. I cut off the plug and replaced with a really good quality black rubber one rated for continuous use at 13 Amps. Temperature is now about 30ºC. Problem solved. I don't think anyone would notice the difference.
Ned

 

[noxid1969]

As it is leased and you are concerned about the plug, get any friendly electrician to fit a plug for you and provide an invoice for a 'professional installation', you are then covered. I do doubt they would notice either way as some lease companies seem genuinely surprised the car can be charged and even try and offer the PHEV with 7 seats as an option.

 

[NightPHEVer]

I charge it daily on a regular IP66 13A socket I had installed on my driveway

It might be worth changing the socket too as this could either have been a bit suspect in the first place, or is now because it's got too hot. This sort of overheating appears to occur because either the quality of the socket or plug is suspect, or the fit/connection between the two is a bit slack for some reason, allowing it to arc across any tiny gaps there might be.

 

[anko]

Indeed I would suspect a bad contact between plug and socket causing high resistance on the contract surface with too high temperature as a result. In these cases imho the more likely cause is the socket, nor the plug. With all due respect, with that in mind I can see why they don't want to replace it for you.

 

[jamiewakeham]

Thanks for all the advice.

It's a good (£25) socket from MK; I guess they are not immune to manufacturing errors, though. I've just run the charger for ten minutes; plug became noticeably warm. I then ran a 2000w heater for the same time; this was significantly less warm.

The fuse is still working, but getting it out of the plug took pliers. Some of the internal plastic has melted onto the fuse.

These two facts rather point to the problem being a crappy connection within the plug, don't they? And thinking about it, I've noticed it being warm when plugged into other people's sockets too.

What to do now? My contract is with an independant lease firm, not direct with Mitsubishi. I can easily go and raise merry hell with my local dealer, but really they've done nothing wrong - they've just diagnosed the problem and told me that Mitsubishi UK decline to pay for fixing it. The lease firm and the supplying dealer are both hundreds of miles away.

Part of me wants to take this back to Mitsubishi because I think they are behaving really badly here - go to trading standards, social media, etc. But actually I just want an easy life, and I already have one small claims court case with a car dealer (that's another story) ongoing. Ironically I chose to lease this time precisely because I was sick of the aggro of buying and selling...

I think I'm going to write to the lease company and explain that there is a fault, that MUK have refused to have anything to do with it, and that from a legal point of view my next move should be to ask them to rectify it. And then offer to fix the issue myself, subject to their agreeing not to kick up any fuss at hand-over time. If a new plug still gets worryingly warm I'll replace the socket.

 

[anko]

'Our'(Dutch) plugs are far less complex. No fuse, no temperature sensors. Far less chance of internal issues. Maybe my (fortunately humble) opinion doesn't apply to UK plugs

 

[jaapv]

Thanks for all the advice.

It's a good (£25) socket from MK; I guess they are not immune to manufacturing errors, though. I've just run the charger for ten minutes; plug became noticeably warm. I then ran a 2000w heater for the same time; this was significantly less warm.

The fuse is still working, but getting it out of the plug took pliers. Some of the internal plastic has melted onto the fuse.

These two facts rather point to the problem being a crappy connection within the plug, don't they? And thinking about it, I've noticed it being warm when plugged into other people's sockets too.

What to do now? My contract is with an independant lease firm, not direct with Mitsubishi. I can easily go and raise merry hell with my local dealer, but really they've done nothing wrong - they've just diagnosed the problem and told me that Mitsubishi UK decline to pay for fixing it. The lease firm and the supplying dealer are both hundreds of miles away.

Part of me wants to take this back to Mitsubishi because I think they are behaving really badly here - go to trading standards, social media, etc. But actually I just want an easy life, and I already have one small claims court case with a car dealer (that's another story) ongoing. Ironically I chose to lease this time precisely because I was sick of the aggro of buying and selling...

I think I'm going to write to the lease company and explain that there is a fault, that MUK have refused to have anything to do with it, and that from a legal point of view my next move should be to ask them to rectify it. And then offer to fix the issue myself, subject to their agreeing not to kick up any fuss at hand-over time. If a new plug still gets worryingly warm I'll replace the socket.

That sounds very sensible. The alternative is surely to simply replace the plug and let sleeping dogs lie. I doubt very much whether anybody from the lease firm would notice or care.

 

[greendwarf]

And even if the lease company did complain then you can always threaten them with the Health & Safety at Work Act - makes individual employees personally liable. :lol:

 

[jamiewakeham]

So. My lease company were perfectly happy for me to replace the plug myself. I've just given the car a full charge, and it is barely warm - the old one would have been really quite hot by the end of the process.

It is utterly clear to me that the original plug has been faulty right from day one.

Mitsubishi have given their dealer network a photo of a plug that looked just like mine and explicitly stated that this is not a warranty issue, and the only action the dealer can take is to order a replacement cable. I'm going to have a bit of a chat with them about this now.

 

[Harald]

... I think I'm going to ...

If I were on your place and have this topic, I would not worry about all legeal aspects and simply do the technical repair as needed.

 

[jamiewakeham]

So I did the obvious thing and replaced the plug, once I had permission to do so from the lease company who technically own the car. Problem utterly solved: it no longer gets hot while charging. Having removed it I examined the old plug and found that parts of it had internally melted around the fuse.

I've written to Mitsubishi UK and asked for an apology for their not honouring their warranty, and for them to withdraw the bulletin so that no-one else with the same problem gets fobbed off with an £800 bill.

They've got back to me. They are offering to replace my whole charger as an act of 'goodwill'. I've pointed out that I don't want a new charger as mine is now working perfectly, thanks very much. They have then said that my modifications will invalidate the warranty and that I have 30 days in which to accept the new charger. It is not yet clear to me whether they are threatening to invalidate the charger's warranty or the whole car's.

They've also said that they will not withdraw this bulletin (which I should never have been shown) and that the dealer initially didn't offer to replace the charger because it was 'not possible to determine' that it was a manufacturing defect (absolute rubbish - the dealer took one look and said 'we're not allowed to take this because it says so here').

So, my dilemma. Do I accept the goodwill charger, which I very much imagine will come with a non-disclosure agreement attached to it? Or do I ask Mitsubishi to confirm that they are threatening to invalidate my warranty for the sake of an aftermarket plug, and then see what the Guardian's consumer champoins or Honest John want to make of it? I just hate the idea that they are getting away with this with other people.

 

[greendwarf]

As you have pointed out - you don't own the car, so you must accept their offer unless the lease company agrees otherwise.

 

[jamiewakeham]

I think my plan of action is:

1) write to lease company and explain the situation. They did give me permission to change the plug, but faced with Mitsubishi threatening to invalidate warranty I am quite sure they will instruct me to accept the new charger.

2) write to Mitsubishi to ascertain exactly what they mean by invalidating warranty - of the charger or of the whole car. Not that it'll make much difference but I'm interested to know.

3) once I have the new charger, go to motoring press.

Having absolutely loved the car for almost two years, and sung its praises to all who'd listen, this has seriously soured my relationship with Mitsubishi. I can't help wonder how many people have handed over £800 for a new charger.

 

[jamiewakeham]

So, just to provide closure to this thread (and as a service to anyone else who finds themselves in the same boat):

My lease company, most unsurprisingly, instructed me to take the replacement charger. It's identical to the old one, but thankfully doesn't seem to be heating up like the old one did. This provides more proof (if any were needed) that the original fault was the charger plug, not the socket.

Mitsubishi continue to insist that this was never a warranty issue. Reading between the lines, their position is that I must somehow have damaged the original plug. They have explicitly told me that they will continue with this policy, so if someone else arrives at their dealer with a similar melted plug, they will be turned away and told that Mitsubishi won't take responsibility. I think this is shocking behaviour, and almost certainly illegal.

I've written to a few journalists to ask if they'd like to take this up, but had no response.

So, if you have a charger with a melted plug, all that I can suggest is that you go direct to Mitsubishi UK, tell them that you know full well that other chargers have been replaced FoC with this fault, and demand a new one.

 

[Tipper]

You need to get the outdoor socket checked by an electrician too as the overheating of the plug pin may have affected the socket internals too.